Everything in business is about the "bottom line". If the bottom line for each company involved won't be on red ink, then you might have a point there. If a proposal is presented to Rane/Serato to produce a new or continue with the legacy of the 1200's it will have to show that is a potential $$$ maker, not just to preserve an outdated technology that has been pushed to the side by the majority of dj's around the world.

the Tech-nology could be updated for sure. Start with the M5G, add a couple midi knobs/buttons. WOW!

I'm just not sold on the controller market. I see it has a place but as long as DJs like me are alive there will always be a market for Technics. I only hope that newer generations find that same inspiration.

I mean they just started selling turntables in Target, Costco, Best Buy....

adding record sections again to big music stores....

you think someone buying an audiophile 180g re-issue pressing of a classic album only wants to buy an Ion USB turntable.

REAL DJ'S USE VINYL
Therefore real DJ'S need turntable's
Serato & Technic 1200 series turntable's are the industry standard.

My vote is being cast for building & producing as many 1200's can be produced.

the mk5 is not discontinued nor is it going to be maybe if they lower the retarded 1000 dollar price ppl would be able to buy them i know i would

If you compare the prices, yes. Someone that is an audiophile will skip the 1200 and for a pro-ject or VPI.

Real DJ's use skills not just a specific equipment.

pro-ject pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com

VPI www.audioadvisor.com

big price difference between those two and I had to google both. I'm guessing the guy buying Zeppelin 4 in Best Buy will go for the Pro-Ject and the guy who is on waiting lists for limited mail order pressing will get the VPI. Neither of those come close to DJ use.

Real DJs can get the job done without turntables.

When I bought my first set of decks it really was the only option and the market drove the price down to just over wholesale. Now that they are completely optional its more of a personal choice to use a turntable at all. I've already gone down the route of using CDJs and controllers and now I am back to 1200s for a reason that I can't really put into words (I'm obviously trying though).

I just think that it has made it this long that it still has some life left considering the vinyl market's growth in the last couple years.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, slow down little buddy, you don't have the exact numbers. So don't say, the majority of djs are using something else than turntables!
What I see, in my hometown, the biggest town in Germany, Berlin is: Technics 1200/12100 Mk2 everywhere! There is maybe the one or other dj using CDjs or a controller, but that is a very small number of djs here!

i have tried both,yes you need skills using either tables or cdj's/controllers,no doubt,but it all started w/ vinyl and tables,so keeping it real to its roots is what its called,i remember when cdj's fist came out,no dj's wanted to touch them,but carring cd's made it easir than carrying vinyl so that was the major advantage,no with serato and other dvs solutions, we all need to stick to the roots and use vinyl,scratching and juggling beats on cdj's is nothing close to using 1200's.
case in point, the DMC world champion competition's all use turntables, not cdj's,
i do not even think there is a competition for cdj dj's is there?????

personally my vote is A, but I would not mind B at all

Unfortunately, it's about the BOTTOM LINE.

Did you see this?--->>1) Since beginning of the last decade, our sales of turn-table has been decreasing drastically. It's almost one-fifteenth sales units compared with 10 years ago.

1 / 15th of what it was to begin with??? And that's over a 10 year span dude...

That is a hard, cold fact, and it's irreversable...

You would have to come up with an idea that either

A.) Would show growth potential of REVERSING that trend, and a 10 year steady decline is hard to flip around...

B.) Not only convince Technics, but the suppliers who discontinued the parts for said Technics turntables.

If you could show ANYTHING with that type of proven Growth Potential, I'm buying stock TODAY...

NEW DJ's = NEW MONEY

But today's "NEW DJ's" would rather not have the hassle of "Learning' how to tweak a turntable, but rather get a CDJ or Controller, and some free MP3's.

Not gonna happen dude.

they would have to introduce an updated/limited edition model to introduce new sales.

let me at some MK6s I'll buy them

Jensen, just in case you didn't know these units last an eternity and a half. Those units that you see are at least 5 years old and will go on for ever and making another turntable purchase will not happen in 10 or more years. You are right I don't have the numbers but this is the TREND that it's been going since the introduction of the CDJ's. Johnny M gotz it riht on point.

We need a cash for clunkers program for all 1200's and get them off eBay and start buying NEW 1200's to resurrect and get rid of the declining sales trend.

damn I wish a) becomes true!

yeah, I've already started that

send me your tired, broken, and used 1200s. I will rebuild them.

We have the technology

I want some brand new ones though and I got priced right out.

ok where's my $500 check for my broken down turntable

Danny, DVS like Serato stopped that trend, I know a lot of house djs were using CDJs, some were still using vinyl and since Serato and Traktor & ... more of these cats are back to vinyl. Some ar using controllers now, i know that, but saying that the majority of the djs is using other things than turntables these days, without having the exact numbers is bs! I personally know like 100 DJs, not one of them is using anything else like turntables. Maybe wedding djs are all over CDJs, but when it comes to the club DJs and you are not playing house/techno/...it's all about turntables, here, where I am.

I hate CDs and DVDs with a passion now.

I will always love/use/play vinyl.

Hybrid deck, 1200 guts + Midi controller surface

they tried the CD/TT hybrid, it failed.

maybe a controller/realTT hybrid is the next "it" dj item


looking at the new controllers coming out and it's more of the same thing over and over...buttons, faders, platter...how many times are they going to rearrange it?

^^^exactly what I said, read between the lines.

DVS did NOT stopped the trend, they slowed it down and with prices the way they are most are buying used 1200's it's starting to decline again and quick!
As I mentioned on the other thread, it is technics fault for designing an indestructible unit.

I know the market for turntables , even worldwide is small. Only DJs, club owners and some vinyl collectors/lovers (but this scene is growing lately, btw the vinyl sales also) will buy turntables and not that many, because they last long (I know that Danny).
But vinyl will always be around, so somebody needs to make turntables and somebody will. It's not like Technics has to invest a lot in machines, product developement,...to make them, they have everything already, they just sell less..., so they have to lower the output...it's there decision what they want to do and we can't turn back the hands of time, but if they don't make 'em anymore than Stanton, Vestax, or ... will produce turtables. Also Technics is not living of turntables, the make other things too, so this is just a side track for them...
From the money side turntables are even cheaper than CDJs, like the 400/800/850/900/1000/2000/... so buying new gear/used gear is cheaper on the vinyl route...and since Serato/Traktor/...you don't need CDJs to play an mp3 file...

i hate cdj's to, vote for a and/or b

Again, Danny, if you want to satisfy your customers than you make an relieable product like Technics does with the MK2s.

here is your target market right here:

serato.com

bought my 1200's when i was 8 years old,1982 & still work like the day i bought them

You are not understanding the engineering/design part of a product. You have to design a product that will last you "x" amount of years and that is IT. You will be forced to go out and buy more. Technics messed this part for themselves.

All products today are designed to fail within a matter of time. TV's, IPods, laptops etc. you name it.

1982? C'mon man, you aren't going to convince me you were 8 and got 1200's in 1982.

How old are you?

However, I acquired mine in 1985 and was 18, so a 28 year old turntable is not far from the truth...

However, 8 years old?

C'mon man....

so make it better

innovate, they stopped doing that

it's not perfect and there is technology now that didn't exist in the beginning of the their sales decline.

I honestly don't think Technics thought this Turntable would last as long as it did...

But I DO think they thought they would continue to dominate the DJ world with the release of their CDJ...

But we know that was a BOMB.

That's where they messed up....and Pioneer cornered the market.

If the CDJ that Technics designed was engineered better, people would have bought that, (if they NEEDED to go digital), JUST on the strength of the Technics name....

However, that product was so horrible, and they didn't do enough to re-engineer it in time...

I got you Danny, but I don't think that they had that goal to make it unbreakable. Just relieable. I saw still a lot of MK2s in bad conditions in clubs...they just don't send them in for repair...the light were breaking down so fast...that plastic thing that locks the tone arm and the tone arm itself are parts they don't last forever...the rest is almost unbreakable, like you said. But on the other hand, if you asked people, for advice what turntable to buy, everybody told you get an Technis MK2, they really have a good reputation, that counts, don't forget that.

Here's where it's not worth it.

What is there to make better?

More torque? Better Non-Skip Tonearms? Removable RCA's?

The ONLY thing that would make it better would be removable RCA's...

Why? Because Torque and Skipness are things of the past with DVS...

You don't HAVE to worry about stuff that we used to have to worry about when using REAL VINYL.

The problem is that a DVS program will make ANY TURNTABLE seem applicable.

The turntable in that respect is nothing more than a controller. You don't have to worry about SOUND QUALITY anymore, because that's controlled by the DVS, and RELATIVE mode handles your skip issues.

A gemini turntable can meet those requirements now.

youre absolutely right about the life of new-age items being made not to last so you buy the new one , its a great marketing strategy and is huge with cell phones, here they pop out a new phone every month and have 2 year cell contracts making you pay full retail for the " cool" phones, sad part is people buy into it, and the price of things being so high its just all profit, what ever happened to a good quality product (RANE :) )

They could make line outputs, removeable RCA's like Johnny said, a USB conncection, stop buttons in the other corner, different face plates like customs companies are selling them.
Even with CVs you want that they are running accurate, so don't pull that Gemini thang, Johnny.

Oh I forgot MIDI, like that Vestax turntable.

lol, but you get what I'm saying...

Technics has been the KANG for YEARS, and EVERY SINGLE (DJ) TURNTABLE COMPANY has tried to emulate what made Technics great.

Somebody was bound to get it right, AND implement new technology to boot. Thus you have USB connections, interchangeable tonearms, battle style stop buttons, torque to pull a truck, and digital pitch, AND PITCH BENDS!

Again, they waited too long...

Women come and go, but the MK2s are staying...lol

With all that, these other turntables still didn't "win".

Like you mentioned, with DVS, all these improvements became obsolete:

UBS connections: again, who uses them?
interchangeable tonearms: what for?
battle style stop buttons: who cares? people don't even know how to battle anymore.
more torque: why? It has always been sufficient.
digital pitch: Technics has that
and the big whopper pitch bend: useless with DVS.

Technics is basically fine the way it is. The only real improvement I can see that would help in term of sales would be to implement MIDI to it. Look at the dicers. They're a step in the right direction as far as simplicity goes.... but not too many of us need them because the 57 already does what the dicers do (minus the looping which is easier)

With that said... I love video.

All I need is 2 turntables, a 57 (and hoping for the new 57 with SL3 sound) and that's basically it.

------

PS.... if any company wants turntables to make a come back, they need to start making battles like they used to....

It's all about interest.

turnin 36 in 2 weeks

Dag, you old.

Actually, 1200's SALES were all about PRESTIGE.

DJ's may have started on ANY OLD TURNTABLE, but they ALL strived (if they were smart) to get 1200's.

You weren't considered a REAL DJ, unless you had Technics 1200 MKII's.

Thus DJ's HAD to buy them to even be considered in the running to OFFICIALLY BE a DJ.

That is not the case today.

So EVERY NEW DJ eventually got themselves Technics 1200's.

Now, they look for the sleekest controller possible, and Turntables are an "Afterthought".

After CDJ's, and controllers...

And with the other cheaper brands with more "bells and whistles", a DJ seeking to get an Official Technics branded turntable is more a rarity than the norm.

Pitch bend is not useless with dvs, if my tech's had the same features as my stantons I would use them more because I prefer the overall build and look of them. But i prefer to use my stantons for the pitch bend, removable rcas, internal grounding, and torque... Pitch bend is alot more convenient than riding the pitch slider or platter

And factor in the "DJ Morals" of the "Artform" and there you go.

This is how the new Generation of "DJ's" think.

This is true...

But you might as well say Technics "Retired" from the race, save lack of a better term than "Forfeited" the race.

It's like going to see Mike Tyson when he first started out, and paying HUNDREDS of dollars to see a great fight, and the mess lasts 45 seconds...

Nobody came to the fights anymore...

They KNEW Mike was gonna knock everybody out...

Then what happened? Dude got lazy (Think Technics not keeping up with technology), and here comes Busta Douglas (Pioneer), when nobody's watching...

and Mike Tyson is no mo..... People don't rejoice for Mike anymore, they moved on.

c'mon bro, don't remind me, been collecting vinyl since then too,i guess thats why 1200's will always be the real deal for me,i'm all for technology but some things just can't change, i remember when i got serato in 2006 my brother thought that was stretching keeping it real

I would love to see the old Mike fight the Klitschkos...
Heavyweight boxing is so boring these days, they have no competition!
I bet Mike would have knocked them out, like everybody else, in seconds, boom!

Right. Now Technics IS STILL RELEVANT, but not from a Corporate investment perspective.

It's going to die a slow death because the little people (people who make the components), aren't getting the turnaround they need....

There is NO NEW (or old) FEATURE that Technics can come up with that would be good reason for anyone who currently owns a working Technics 1200 to go out and buy a BRAND NEW ONE.

Right, they still dominated the turntable market, even with this "getting lazy"...
But they really could own the market to almost 100%, lately they lost a little market share to other companies...

Are you really trying to discredit pitch bend as the tool of a real DJ because it uses a temporary button to do the same thing as hand movements. so i can press + or - to fine tune and allow the pitch to stabilize back to its setting or i can move a slider back and forth to do the same function... or i can touch the record that is playing... or i can rub the platter to slow it down.

one of those definitely sounds like cheating or taking the easy way out...

You sir are ridiculous in the way that you think.

Dude, you didn't even GET what I was saying.

I wasn't calling you a FAKE DJ, I simply said THAT FEATURE is something that you CHOOSE Stanton over TECHNICS for.

Now, the argument of a "Real DJ" using Pitch Bend is as ridiculous as the argument of a "REAL DJ" no using DVS.

The point is that "Pitch Bend" made you choose Technics over (gasp) Stanton.

Now, multiply that times however many DJ's think like you...and add up the numbers for Technics.

Not good.

huh? a little market share? u serious? try competing with pioneer, denon. These guys are currently committed to using new technology, technics isn't and haven't in a LOOOOONG time.

And as far as dominating the turntable market, this is true but there are no huge sales or huge profit margins because people are buying used and refurbished units. There are very few "NEW" turntables sales.

The ONLY way Technics could regain this ground is to again come up with some "Features" that EVERYBODY wants, or needs, and get all the NEW DJ's to buy their product.

As a matter of fact, it should be something that even makes those who currently OWN 1200's go out and purchase the new jawns.

The trick here though, is for those who already own 1200's NOT to sell them on Craigslist, as that will bite into the "NEW DJ" market, and stop sales of the "Featured" 1200's.

Like how you went out and bought an SL1, then bought a 57, and kept the SL1 as backup.

See how much money Rane made there?

Then came the SL3, so technically, you could sell your SL1 (and old technology).

Exactly my point. Especially at the prices they're charging nowadayz.

Guys, obviously everybody in here is a DJ, some use Technics MK2s, some Stantons, others use Vestax,...we all love to use vinyl, sometimes real vinyl, most of the time Serato CVs...
if Technics decides to stop making turntables, we won't be able to turn back the time, but I'm pretty sure vinyl will alway be around and somebody will step in and take Technics place. Don't get me wrong, I love my Tehnics turntables!

@ Danny I was talking about that Technics lost market share in the turntable market to other companies who are making turntables!

The truth is that they basically built an indestructable item. They lasted for the last 20 + years...so it's plausible to believe they will last 20 + more years..

The issue, however, is what will be the preferred method of DJ'ing in the future?

and so your vote is....

I hear some quitters in here.


Techs for life, who's with me!

my only concern with them not being made anymore or w/e is the fact that the replacement is 1)also overpriced, 2) Stanton in my opinion makes flashy garbage i bought headphones from them and they are complete shit, makes me worry about spending 800 bucks on a pair of st150's......

and the MK5 is not discontinued btw

WITH YA ALL DAY LONG BROTHER

Dude, I ain't paying 1000.00 for a single Technics 1200.

I bought mine for 250.00 apiece BRAND NEW...

AND COULD SELL THEM ON EBAY/Craigslist FOR MORE, 25 YEARS LATER...

Ain't no way.

I think, we will see all the different gear, like we see it already: turntables, CDJs, controllers...it does't matter what you use as long as you keep the people on the floor dancing and the party going, but for myself, I love my Technics turntables and vinyl!

And that's ANOTHER THING, over the past 10 years, it's not JUST bout the Turntable market share dropping, it's the fact that Turntables are no longer the "Only" medium for manipulating music.

It's a wrap fellas.

I mean, I'd LOVE for Technics to keep producing Turntables.

But...

Will I buy a NEW one?

No...

Why?

Because I have some that are indestructable...

I can get Extras from Craigslist and Ebay...

And I ain't paying 4x's more the price of what I originally paid.

Hell, I'll probably be DEAD before my 1200's die.

Yeah, it's almost indestructable...but what If you like that pitch slider and the button that puts the pitch back to zero on the M3D/MK5 ? You might buy an M3D/MK5 and if you buy it used, somebody else bought it new, before...I know they are not selling that money new turntables, but it's still way cheaper than going the CDJ route and how long are lasting those?

Oh Turtables ARE MUCH CHEAPER than going the CDJ route...

But honestly, NOBODY uses that PITCH BACK TO ZERO feature...

Nobody.

thats why i still own the originals,no extra features needed,dicer works fine

I guess i misunderstood you. Technically i didnt choose either... I own both. I just typically prefer to use the stanton's for their features, but I do use both. I will keep one set up at the house and one in cases for gigs. I don't like to get to used to the features for gigging tho, since most clubs use 1200s.

Let everybody make his own decision and get off your high horse, Johnny!
I used it.

You are the ONLY ONE...

BTW, what would you use it for?

not a quitter but very realistic.

This thread is all idealism, realism is what we are fighting against. Vinyl defies the odds. It's the underdog.

Don't quit on me.rally up

What do you think, boiling water?

It could have been your "Crush It" button...

I'm sayin, you'd use the button vs. just moving the pitch back to zero?

So they stop making them there are a good few hundred thousand of them around so its not like there gonna die off.

Have been stacking bread For years with a wepond called the technics 1200. Will continue to kill dancefloors with such deadly wepond. I hope some day I can pass on the tradition to some one with the decide to murder a dancefloor just like my self.

It's an option, I used it sometimes... in most cases I move the pitch slider.

my 3 year old son is infatuated w/ the 1200's,passing on to the new generation

My little boy was the same age, when he was standing behind my Technics turntables and used them, he loves to stop the record, let it go and his little baby scratches.

I see what you did there

does the same thing, my friends cdj, he has no interest in it, always wants to play the record he says,
even a 3 year old knows real dj's use vinyl and 1200's!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep they do know that! And it is so much more fun! My boy and me we were listening to old fairytale records, I still have from my childhood. There were no CDs around at that time. I know these records by heart and I can even tell you where the scratch is, where it skips (this one particular record).

okay some of us don't want to see this thing fade away. what are we going to do about it. how do we get their attention before it's too late (if it not already is)?

I'm being serious...
some ideas I had while doing dishes this morning yfrog.com

Technics Artists Series

Eric Orr X Technics 1200
Shepard Fairey X Technics 1200

Technics Designer Series

Gucci X Technics 1200
Louis Vuitton X Technics 1200


Technics DVS Series

Serato X Technics 1200
Traktor X Technics 1200


there is some coin right there. Hire me to stretch this product line. I'll move to Japan.

So with the artist series turntables, the cost won't be $1050 a piece any more. Hmm I wonder if people will for out $1600 for a customized 1200 single unit. Dub, hope doesn't work on any successful business model.

THIS PART HAS TO HAPPEN, other series would just be ways to extend the line.

Add midi, line-outs, digital pitch, color-changing leds, internal ground...any of those things can be done without jacking the price.

well, maybe not the midi part

but i would pay CDJ-2000 prices for a controller that plays records as good as a 1200.

Dude, pretty designs on the base is not going to cut it.

PLUS you would have to sell it for LOWER than it's priced now to even BEGIN to generate some type of buzz.

But again, if you sell it LOWER than what it is, you can't pay the suppliers to stay in business to produce the components.

You have to come up with a "Feature" that is able to be PATENTED (sp?), that will make EVERY DJ want to buy a pair of 12's.

Short of that, it's a wrap.

The funny thing is that, let's say it was REALLY REALLY confirmed that Technics wasn't going to produce ANY more 1200's, the market is already chock full of stock that could STILL compete with Stanton and other Turntable makers.

Technics can STILL OWN the market and never make another Turntable.

Forget JACKING the price, you need to LOWER the price....

Again, EVERY NEW DJ would have to purchase a new Technics...

NO CONTROLLERS...

NO CDJ's...

Technology won't let that happen.

lower the price to what?

these things won't ever be cheaper than $700 new again

I can see a new model coming out with $900-1000 price tag and if it hits the right marks.... I'm buying it.

midi being the killer feature there

in and out

meaning can be controlled by a midi controller and isa midi controller

Im still not buying any decks for a looong time, these are still going strong.....midi or not!

You don't get it.

Imagine you're a NEW DJ hitting the market in need of equipment, and you don't have generous parents.

What are you going to buy on your limited budget?

Technics 1200's - 900.00 - 1000.00 x 2 = 1,800.00 - 2000.00

CDJ's - 1000 X 2 = 2000.00

Controller - (Somebody fill in the price, but I will say 1000.00 just for argument)

+

Laptop - 1000.00

What route is a kid going to go?

Fisher price turntables?

Them jawns ain't cheap no mo neeva...

That's cause fisher price, unlike technics, upgraded their turntable technology to all digital circuiry and midi features were also included.

Come on guys are you kidding me... This is not a product for beginning DJs, the controller market has that. This is a high end precision instrument for professionals that demand nothing less.

Dude, you're not getting it.

Technics was on top because ALL DJ'S ASPIRED TO OWN ONE. Point blank.

That is NOT the case now.

The market share of DJ's that fall in the category that YOU'RE describing could NOT support a revival of Technics.

They need the entire PIE, not a slice of it.

You have to think Global. (No Stickam).

R.I.P.

Technics was always a global player, they sold their MK2s worldwide, they just let some slices of the turntable market slip through their hands into the hands of Vestax, Stanton,...when they could have eaten up the whole cake...and with the start of the CDJs they faced a smaller getting market

I disagree. (respectfully)

They already have the basics down. They already own brand loyalty. They haven't changed the design in almost 40 years and they still sell today. They already have a huge slice of the pie and IMO the most important one. If the top DJs in the world demand to use nothing less that Technics 12XX, then new DJS will still aspire to own them. Rich parents will still buy the best for they're spoiled kids and if the best is the new Technics 1250 then Guitar Center will be slinging them out the door.

they said that in 1996

I disagree. (respectfully)
+2

Dub,

ALL THE TOP DJ'S ALREADY USE 1200's.

It's the NEW DJ's that aren't buying them.

I see a majority of new dj's leaning towards purchasing:

www.numark.com
www.xone.co.uk
www.vestax.com

due to portability and affordability.

+10

Dub is in denial, but we're here to help him through this.

You can't reverse a trend that has been going on for 10 years, and is now at 1/15th of what it was.

Exactly.

And that's IF THEY GO WITH TURNTABLES...

I mean to say, that the affordability factor is mostly unreachable for NEW DJ's, unless they buy USED from Craigslist.

But buying from Craigslist doesn't help Technics.

I hate those controllers with passion and I can't take them serious!
Maybe it is for bedroom DJs, beginners, a bar, wedding DJs, whatever, but how can these toys as good as expensive dj mixer you guys all own? And these tiny wheels, that stuff is not made like an RAne, Ecler,...mixer, you guys are all over the best of the best faders and than you wanna buy that cheap ass plaistic controller shit? It's redicolous!

JOHNNY.

I'M SAYING MAKE A NEW TURNTABLE THAT TOP DJS WANT TO BUY, AN UPGRADE FROM WHAT WE HAVE NOW.

NOT....keep doing the same thing and expect different results, that's insane.

CDs are like cassettes, a passing format. So why are new CDJs coming out?

Vinyl on the other hand, obviously has some life left.
serato.com
serato.com

I don't want to offend anybody, don't get me wrong, but don't support that crap!
There is a little small market for that, yeas, but don't say this is substituting the MK2 and a decent mixer!

that's how I'm feeling about it. There is a place for them, but it's not for me. The target market I am in needs turntable innovation.

and this would cover about 95% of Dj's

trust me, i don't like these either. i love my 1200's but this is REALITY.

You are hinging on TOP DJ's buying NEW stuff to influence "NEW DJ's" to follow in their footsteps.

You are not addressing the corporations that supply the part to create these turntables.

You are not addressing the manufacturing process, as Technics has a standard, and they'll need to re-tool their factories to build Turntables with Midi, Flashy LED's, Quickswap RCA's, and a Crush button. IT TAKES MONEY TO EVEN DO THAT.

Not to mention, there would be a curve on implementating those new features, as all those changes (and they'll have to be dramatic to catch these DJ's EYES), will be subject to Murphy's law, and a particular build will probably have issues.

Most might wait until version 2.0 of whatever.

Like I said, I've got Turntables that have stood the test of time, have INCREASED IN VALUE, and show no sign of quitting.

I'm NOT paying 4 times what I paid years ago, for a product that will do EXACTLY what mine currently do.

Sorry man....

I love my 12's, but there's a recession man.

Exactly 95% EASY.

this is the case with all new high end gear. What Technics/Panasonic is missing is the lower end models that provide additional revenue. CDJ2000s, DJM-2000, SIXTY-EIGHT, A&H DB4, they are all going for the top tier...




that is one of Technics bigger problems. which is why we have c) accept defeat and customize all 3 million 1200s in the world

and if that is how it unfolds, there are 3 million chassis that could use an aftermarket digital pitch fader, upgraded tonearm, etc. shit, we could even design a new motor that fits in that chassis since the fitting is standard.
'


neither are you since they only pump these things out every few years and then stockpile them, which means that factory gets retooled every time there is a new batch. The big decision they are making (or made) is whether to go through that process again.

didn't you just do that with your 56S, that thing was 20 times the price of your Radio Shack mixers and it does the same thing.


A few months ago I could get a brand new MK5 in silver for $549 wholesale price, but I bought one for $750 retail...why...I wanted it in Black.

look at me and my Johnny style quotes....

I am impressed.

didn't you just do that with your 56S, that thing was 20 times the price of your Radio Shack mixers and it does the same thing.


That was a good point. However, what has CHANGED, and forced ME to change is that the type of Scratching to be accepted as "Current" requires a loose fader.

The Realistic doesn't have that, because if it DID, I'd still use it as my main mixer.

The style of DJ'ing has changed from RECORD manipulation to FADER manipulation. Before, it really didn't matter what type of MIXER you had, as long as your hands were fast.

Take for example, how Jazzy Jeff was on that GEMINI back in the day.

Now, it's about clicks, flares, twiddles, and fader exercises, vs. backspins (no wheelout), REAL MIXING...(lol), "Trick Mixing", using the up and downs, doubling up, etc..etc.

Today's skill level is measured by how a DJ can use 1 hand to scratch to a BEAT.

That's whack to me, but the masses have accepted it, so it's now the standard.

and you are moving with the times.

I've jumped on the Dicer tip and I am just blown away that the space they take up hasn't been used by anything but a 45 adaptor for 35 years. I use cues points and loops with my turntable, something I never imagined when I first bought them.

Now...I'm using my imagination. I'm committed to lugging these beasts around as long as I DJ. I love them. The only thing I could imagine loving more is a turntable with built in midi buttons and a few refinements.

I love my Traktor Kontroll X1!
I had a little beat juggling trainings session last week and as I went down from 8 to 4 to 2 beats I realized dayumn it's getting harder and harder by the end I was cheating, using my X1 with the cue buttons instead of turning back the records and I got really fast with the beat juggling...

what I refuse to give up is the vinyl->needle->rotating combo. I think that particular element will be an edge that ALWAYS separates pros from amateurs. If you can keep the needle in the groove and move your hand back and forth...I'm impressed.

Now...consider how much Serato and Ortofon just spent on developing a new cartridge, do you really think they want to see what it attaches to fall to mediocre replacements. They have already made a significant investment to the industry of vinyl players for DJs and now we are loosing the main element.

It's like people making new wheel designs for horse buggies and infrared night vision goggles for horses. Except a lot of us actually still use these things and there are still new turntable DJs every day.

There should be changes to the current 1200's though...I can't take credit for these suggestions but an acquaintance of mine said these would be the best improvements on the 1200's

built in Phono pre + ADC with these output jacks on the Back:

-10 RCA L R
+4 XLR L R
USB

3 Pole High Pass Rumble Filter switch (OFF / 30HZ / 60 HZ)

Ground Lift switch

Yeah, but they were slow on the draw too. What I mean by that, is the sometimes questionable link between the headshell and the tonearm, (and ensuing RCA's).

How long did Ortofon have that contact issue with the Concordes before changes were made?

How long did it FINALLY take to create REALLY skip resistant needles?

There are STILL setup issues when playing from place to place when using Turntables with Serato. Thus the need to calibrate EACH time you set up.

Then you have general setup issues that NEW DJ's probablly wouldn't have the patience to get correct, thus get frustrated, thus seek a simpler means of setup.

Do you realize how much effort it takes to get a Turtable customized to YOUR particular "fit"?

Everything from Buttarugs, to Cartridge Setup, to knowing how to deal with feedback, sunny conditions with vinyl, bumpy dance floors, you name it.

There are a LOT of reasons for a NEW DJ, to skip over ALL that "nonesense" (to us that have been doing it for years, most of these requirements are easy to fix), and jump to a different means of DJ setup.

And, don't let a channel go "out".

Turntables are built for a particular type of DJ.

Most NEW DJ's of TODAY, aren't built like that.

You guys had all the chance in the world to keep the 1200/1210 alive,
simply by buying enough units.
You didn't. Tough luck.
It's a pure business decision on Matsushita's part, new tooling will cost more than the income made on sales of new turntables, hence new tooling will not be made.

An era in DJ history is over, and I guess that in a certain context, this is sad.
But, the 1200/1210 mostly appeal to the guys who has been DJ'ing for a long time, not the DJ's coming on the scene of recent years. Us "old guys" will miss it, but that's about it.

I for one would take a Numark TTX/TT500, Stanton STR8.150 or Vestax PDX over a SL1210 any day.
Not because I don't like the SL1210 (I own 8 pcs...) but because I like the features like higher torque motor, straight tonearm and other extra features on the competitors better.
It has been a, small but still valid, evolution on the product that has basically been the same since 1972.(79 for the MK2's)
And all for the better IMHO.

I get that some of the "old guys" embrace the SL1200/SL1210 and love it for everything it has contributed in the DJ scene so far, but I honestly think it's time to move on. SL1200/1210's are a thing of the past and not the way of the future.
I'm not saying they will disappear from the DJ-scene, I am certain that they will remain for years, but it is pretty obvious that they are not contributing to the evolution of DJ'ing.
Sure, if you'd like for DJ'ing to be exactly what it has been the last decade, stay with the SL1200/1210.
But if you'd like for DJ'ing to evolve into something new, fresh and exciting I think it's time to start looking for something else!

And on a side note, for you guys saying that the SL1200/SL1210 is indestructible, I would just like to say that that is utter bullsh*t.
Sure, they have an excellent build quality and will last for years and years, but like any other electronic device, it will brake and fail and need repair and attention.
I've been distributing and repairing SL1200/SL1210 since 1998 and for the last 5-6 years we've earned almost just as much money on repair/parts sale as has we have on direct sale of the turntables. Now that's something to think about ;)

+1

the prices for turntables have helped the sale of controllers too, say you want a rane 56 and 2 turntables and lets throw in an LPD8 and sl1 its roughly 3 grand with current prices, now tell me what newcomer is going to take that leap? why not buy a 400 dollar controller and youre done, you cant see it from a Dj's perspective, look at it as someone comin into the game as a teenager/20 something year old......

you no undastaaaand noone want toontable, too many pawts, too much layba, we no make monee off toontable, it ode, people come look at toontable they look but no buy, der no honow in be broke, we sell TV and DVD now, people come in stoa and say HEY TV DVD THAT COOL, we make many yen, what done is done, what left YOU BUY NOW!!

And that's what YOU have to understand that NEW DJ's are doing.

I would LOVE for aspiring DJ's to at least OWN some vinyl, but the truth of the matter is that, it's extremely hard to get vinyl, and DIG and appreciate the artform like we did many moons ago.

Hell, most NEW DJ's haven't even touched a 45, much less own one.

Why are they gonna buy 2000 worth of equipment for a medium (barring CV's), that is extremely limited?

You`re wrong when it comes to money Johnny. The last M3D and MK5 a friend bought, he got them from ebay, one like new, almost not used the other one rarely used in very good conditon. One was 300 the other one 340 Euros buy it now...at the same time you can'T find a used CDJ 800 on ebay for less than 400 something, the CDJ 1000 like 600 and up...so they cost more. I don't know how much a controller is, but for CDJs vs. MKs you are wrong.
Ok, you need vinyls at least two (don't look into that CV collectors thread ha ha, you'll catch the collectors fever) and needles. With a CDJ you won't spend nothing extra for a while unless your laser needs a repair...

True but in this situation that purchase didnt make the company any money, bringing us back to point A, the reason their not making them anymore, new jacks arent buying them. They either get em used or go the CD\controller route

AGAIN, BARRING A NEW DJ GETTING IT FROM EBAY OR CRAIGSLIST...

What good is it to Technics if that NEW DJ doesn't invest NEW MONEY into their product?

Of course we know you can get stuff CHEAP on Ebay/Craigslist, but when I buy NEW STUFF, I want NEW STUFF...Not "slightly used", just "like" new, barely breathed on, etc...

Y'all gotta read the FINE PRINT.

Jensen, this whole thread (conversation), we're just walking around in circles. Johnny made an excellent point and so did you. The problem with your comment is what your friend did isn't helping Technics a whole lot.

I'm sure we are all refering to buying "new" equipment.

Thats another reason more and more people are going to cd\controller way. With vinyl you have to buy the original TTs so lets say 300 a piece off ebay, well then you gotta buy vinyl and needles, then you have to keep those set up correctly and replaced when a vinyl is worn out or needle breaks. VS a cd player that you can spend $20 and have 100 control discs with no upkeep.

I can't make this a habit of quoting Bezzle again...

But he's ABSOLUTELY RIGHT with co-signing me...

So I will co-sign him co-signing me.

+10.

I see you read the FINE PRINT TOO.

I did 10 years ago......

***sigh***

I think you're agreeing with me JUST to make me quote you...

But I will co-sign him co-signing me again....

how do you expect someone to pay 849 each per turntable instead of 200 refurbished ......... i know new shit is cool
but i can get an 04 Gallardo for 84 grand .......just saying

new DJs don't know what they are doing.

I do, and I know that I will be using vinyl to control Serato for a long time to come if not the rest of my life.

I've already gone down the controller path and I'm back. I know the industry is moving in that direction but I am looking past it. Look at this example.
Ean Golden invented and designed the S4 and look at what he uses to DJ. Watchwww.youtube.com 16 arcade buttons and a couple faders. The industry keeps spitting out these complex controllers, but the people driving the DJ industry are keeping things simple.

To stop innovating new turntable designs is the stupidest thing I can think of, when you have new records being pressed every day, new turntable DJs, new cartridge designs, the top two DJ tools being Traktor and Scratch Live both of are based on Digital VINYL emulation.

So then how does Technics survive, if the NEW DJ doesn't invest the money?

You are right, but like someone said before they need repairs too, they are built like tanks and last very long, but some do need repairs...
If you are buying them used, somebody else before you bought them new...and somebody else will buy new ones, maybe even you and you are reselling your old ones...

just for the record....

I'm happy fixing up technics 1200s for the rest of my life, but I'll spend money on a brand new turntable with midi controls.

They know enough to buy a cheap controller (or whatever non brand new Technics TT), and "Do what they have to do to make the party hot".

Then the argument becomes, "Does it matter what equipment the DJ uses, as long as he kills the party?"

(i.e. me and the Realistic....)

Johnny, how does a company who makes high end chronometers survive?
Their chronometers cost like 10 or 20 MKS and the last forever...?

and this thread is about thinking forward, there are enough threads debating about why we are in this situation. I am trying to DO SOMETHING about it. If you even have an ounce of regret seeing Technics fade into the past put it on the table.

i don't excpect anything, i dont really care what anybody buys. but buying used 1200's hurts Technics bottom line. My point is either new dj go for "NEW" controllers or "USED" 1200's. Where is the profit for Technics?

you guys get it now?

But you've also got an alterior motive.

You're the king of CV's, so for you, it would be a MAJOR BLOW to your "industry" specifically, if Turntables as a WHOLE fell off.

with the high prices now i couldnt tell you, im as surprised as you are, keep in mind not everyone in the forums can go spend 2 grand on equipment...

I dont know if this has been mentioned anywhere but my personal source at guitar center told me (and he knows i know my shit and im not a customer who buys shit so i know he wasnt tryna game me) that GC acutually attempted to buy the technics brand from panasonic right after that official release came out about the discontinuation but panasonic declined to sell it to them. So the fact their holding onto the brand gives me some hope they may have something in store for the future

Whats' that? I don't feel like googling...

that's not my industry really it belongs to Rane, Serato, and the rest of the players. I am an educated consumer.

They're not reading the FINE PRINT.

i get what youre saying i am not arguing this point, the point im making is the price range of a pair of techs plus mixer is way beyond the price range for newcomers

from the people who sell their old gear to get the new stuff. are you telling me if Technics releases another turntable with a killer feature you aren't going to be interested in it?

^^^hmmm??

belt drive gemini turntable

that was $400 controller 10 years ago

^was the $400..

My mk2's & mk5 are working just perfectly. I don't need extra buttons to push.

of course they would be interested but if the price is ridiculous then not many will actually buy it, assuming most of us cant easily drop a couple grand on new equipment

it would depend what that feature was and the cost of an alternative...you keep mentioning things like midi buttons, why would i sell my current tables for like 300 to buy a 1200 table when i can just buy a midi controller for $100 bucks

When it comes down to it your paying for nestaliga. Its not a good busniess decession for those in it as a busniess and its WAAAY to expensive for hobbiests. The only people willing to make that leap are the people who have nostalgia for the culture.

Dude, this ain't a funeral. That Turtable was the BEST for an unprecedented amount of time.

But over a decade of declining sales?

I'm sayin, MOST COMPANIES that are losing sales die WAY QUICKER than 10 years....

Technics saw the digital age coming, they made a lame attempt at the CDJ, dropped the ball, decided not to revisit it with ver 2.0, and a LOT of us WAITED IT OUT, meanwhile, other companies look at how Technics did it, and what they DIDN'T DO, and gnawed away at the market.

There's no going back. There are too many components here that make up a 1200 that aren't existing anymore.

But like I'm sayin, you're not an AVERAGE CONSUMER (i.e) NEW DJ.

it IS kinda pointless to argue price points and bargin shopping with a man who drops more money in a year on blank\semi blank vinyl discs than most of us spend on vehicles and houseing for a lifetime LOL

#Nodissjustsaying

if they made their prices lower again they would sell a boat load to new and current users, tell me you wouldnt buy a pair of mk5's for 600 bucks instead of a vcl300........

INTERESTED? - YES.

But what could they possibly come up with, that isn't available on OTHER TT's now, and STILL be at a competitive price?

extra buttons to push^^^

Me PERSONALLY? No, because I've GOT a pair (actually 2), so it wouldn't interest me.

But give that SAME PROPOSAL to a "NEW DJ" and chances are they will pick the VCL.

Portability is ALSO a big factor these days.

Cats don't carry around big stacks like we did back in the day...

Everything is "powered" and smaller...

That's just following the trend...

why when you can just grab some dicers or a nanopad for 50 to 100 bucks that work with your current table.

The fact is technis has NEVER been good at updates, i mean the price difference between the MK5 and M5g was like what 300 bucks and for that you got candy pain, upgraded cables and a +-15....200 difference between MK2 and 5 and you didnt have to worry about the center click

C'mon guys, am I bad, if I buy used MKs? Hell no, everybody has to think about money, if you got it like that, ok, get a pair of M5G brand new, if not than get whatever you can afford. CDJ like the 2000 or 9000 a way to expensive but thats good if DJs think about money the might end up with buying an MK, ha ha.
Do you want to save the world and taking care of Technics? That's rediculous. Are they taking care of me? No. We had a deal, they made their products and sold them to me, fine. I love those turntables and I want to use turntables forever. But I have to think about money and I'm pretty sure Technics does to...see how somebody is manipulatinf prices? Something is now way more than it was before, a product that is in stores already, who's cashing in big time now? The seller, yep bnut you the dj have to pay...it is no shame to buy used gear. Anmd like I said before if you buy it used, somebody else will buy a new one, maybe the person you bought it from...

^^^ The point of this thread was to find a way to "Save" Technics. Buying "used" is not a way to do that.

In our industry wages are rapidly being lowered due not only to the economy but to oversaturation of the market with new jacks on serato using cheap controllers playing for drinks...if the price of your product is going UP in a enviroment where wages are drastically lowered it dosent make sence

nailed it! (NM)

In order for Technics to recapture the market, they'd have to honestly "REINVENT" the Turntable...

****Oh, that was smooth right there, in my parallelism to "Reinvent the WHEEL"....***

Oh, I'm on fire here....

(c)DJJOHNNYM - 2010

To Johnny, a Chronometer is an very exact, accurate running high end watch. But they are not watches, if they are that accurate, they have that name Chronometer. Let's say a name: Rolex. You want one, it starts at 3000 euro new, up to 100 000 or whatever, there is no limit. They last longer than any MK. How do they survive? How many chronometers a customer buys in his lifetime? He might got his from his grandfather...

Another thing im suprised noone is talking about is the human factor involved. Think about it, DJs started spinin on vinyl originally because THAT was the medium that music was presented in, thats what people were comfortable with, people understood how a turntable worked, then it moved to CDs but people still had it in their head that vinyl was what DJs used......no we live in a world where a vast majority of the population has never even SEEN a turntable or touched vinyl, they have no idea how to set up a headshell or calibrate a weight, they only have the guitar center people to ask about products and when they come in a place like this looking for help the old DJs blast fire on their ass for not knowing what the hell to do. If i was a new jack and that hit happened to me id take the turntables to the nearest pawn shop and pick myself up a little controller with the quickeness because THATS the format kids are sued to now, keyboards buttons MP3, cracked fruity loop\ableton WAV files ect.

that's cause you don't see these watches on craigslist or ebay. most are bought NEW

Heres the difference though, that company making that product has JUST THAT to make, panasonic is a company with TONS of other BETTER SELLING shit, panasonic car stereos, tvs, dvd players, toys, appliances. They are in a situaton where they can see large capital streams comming in from other divisions and all they see is a big crashing line of depleting revenue with techs.......for a company like that your best bet is to cut that dying branch off and redivert that money to the wings of your company that ARE making money.

There are always those on the upper end of the Social ladder that buy things like that which keep those companies in business.

The same can be said about those companies that create Exotic cars. Not EVERYBODY is buying them, but enough people ARE, who are forking over wads of loot, thus they stay in business.

Simple.

The Technics 1200 was WAY before it's time. And it STILL is virturally indestructable, if you're talking NORMAL WEAR AND TEAR.

If you're carrying your 1200's from gig to gig, you're gonna drop them occassionally.

Or if you have a set in the club and a lot of VISITOR DJ'S who don't give a damn about the equipment, repair are BOUND to be needed.

Most 12's in a permanent location, with a PERMANENT DJ, that puppy will last FOREVER.

What, you have no clue Johnny, there is a whole lot of sales going on used chronometers on ebay!

Plus look at the consumer bases....how many people buy watches VS how many people are professional DJs, the ONLY people buying new turntables are new and professional DJs who want to acutually put in an investment, so your looking at a small niche market of people which is further splintered with alternative products, also there isnt an "alternative" to a rolex, you wear it as a status symbol (its a luxery item) and you know your buying a high performance watch, there are cheaper alternatives to the tech that do as much if not more.

His name is NOT JOHNNY, and THAT wasn't MY reply.

Cats STILL not reading the FINE PRINT....

***sigh***

the consumer base worldwide for high end watches far outweighs the worldwide consumer base for new DJs who want turntables. Id be willing to bet the # of high end watched sold FAAAR outsold new tech sales. My kiosk sells knockoffs and my mom works in a fine jewelery store and i can tell you that watches are a daily sale.

On expensive cars the car company making a lot of profit. Making a chronometer cost you a lot, the don't make so much profit out of these...it's more like Bezzle said, they can make morte money with tvs, dvds cell phones, whateva, you name it and they think how much profit can we make, is it worth it? If it's not enough for them, they might stop it, ok, what can we do? Save the world? Save poor Technics? Don't get me wrong, I love my MKS, I bought them new, they loved my money, that's it.

One way for Technics to recapture the market is if they made a HYBRID 1200 MKII/CDJ.

Include all that MIDI *ish y'all be talkin' about. allow the platter to be interchanged with another CDJ platter controller, or somehow incorporate the regular platter to manipulate the CD, and make it Native to Serato/ALL DVS's.

Now THAT'S a start. THAT'S worth 1000.00.

hahahaha

Exactly, its not that their "losing money" on techs, its just not making enough to justify it, plus the trend is decreasing which means eventually theyll be losing money so its better to cut your loses and run.

Also dont forget that its not just panasonic in the picture, as it said in that letter their suppliers for important parts are having issues. Having a nonreliable supply chain thats out of your hands is NOT good. I guess the alien saucer that they stole the mineral from that makes techs rock is finally being depelted

the price is a reflection of supply and demand. the supply is low and the demand is high enough to double the price in a year. Whether we like it or not Technics has established themselves in a new price bracket without doing a single thing. All they would have to do is drop the new model at current prices and let the 3M MK2-6s fill the gap below.

If i own a cook-oo-roo and a lemonaide stand, the cook-oo-roo is makin me $100,000 a year and the lemonaide stand is making me $100 a year and the lil girl runnin the stand keeps callin in sick and i see winter comin around the corner im gonna shut the thing down, sure that $100 a year is some nice pocket change but noone drinks lemonaide in the winter but muthafuckas love chicken....that lil girls fucked though (no pedo)

But by doing that your raising supply so the supply demand equation changes back and besides i dont think techs sold that well when the price went up, that wasnt a busniess decession as much as it was the death throws for that table

I do know way more people that bought Technics turntables than 3000 or 5000 euro Rolex chronometers...I know the dj market is small, but how many people can afford an 3000 or 5000 euro Rolex, Breitling,

CDs are dead to me.

really, it's a dying format. do I have to dig up some numbers here or do we agree on that.

so a TT/Midi hybrid is what I want. A turntable that plays my records as good/better than 12XXs and interfaces with software.

lets spec this thing out:
I'm fine with motor the way it is. If there was some way to make it digital and take out more wow/flutter, then badass
RCA phono/line outs (jacks)
internal ground
digital out (coax/USB)
digital pitch control
reverse
midi input
midi output
built in Dicer-like buttons
built in midi knobs.
M5G tone arm

by Bezzles argument the midi stuff isn't adding much to production costs. the midi input and digital motor would require a circuit board redesign, but that might be unavoidable as that is one of the harder parts to get currently. The digital audio would add costs but those parts are readily available and be contracted with ease.

The chassis is solid and I am sure all that stuff can work into a tweaked/existing 1200 frame.

most people cant....thats why these stores have credit cards. im seriosu youd be fucking shocked how many people A DAY come and pick up one of those credit cards and buys crazy expensive shit. To give you a hint my moms avergages like 20 grand in sales A DAY, and we live in hillybilly land USA, so imagine what all those LA moviestars and NY investors are droppin

LMFAO.....i hope everyone here caught the irony that the biggest vinyl record collector on the forum aint fuckin with CDs cause their a dying format.


Heres reality ANY PHYSICAL MEDIUM IS A DYING FORMAT RIGHT NOW

Great way to eff up a nice thread.

Dicers fly off my decks sometimes and I have two extra cables running around my shit. Plus I still need some knobs so I have to have another controller off to the side.

Each deck has:
5 cue/autoloop/loop roll/assignable buttons
+ loop in/out/off dedicated buttons
+ 1 tracks scroll load encode
+ 3-4 assignable midi knobs

Bez

in the DJ market: more people are moving toward vinyl and controllers

in the consumer market: vinyl sales and digital sales growing/CDs sales dying

But not to those who come up to you at Weddings at the last minute, and have the song you NEED, but it's on CD.

You can't erase that medium yet, also throw in a user replaceable HD to store songs, so in case your PC DIES, you have an instant backup.

Damn.

But the DJ Market is NOT moving towards VINYL...

Stop it man...

LOL, Dub, it's cool, you're in denial.

Johnny.

I've been selling records for over a decade now. You can't tell me I'm not selling more records today that I was 5 years ago.

I say instead of bawling over Technics, if you guys feel that passionately about it, form your own company and build turntables. Turntables that follow technics model without voilating their copyrights and at the same time appealing to the new dj's..

Now is the perfect era in time for a start-up company to become the next facebook/google of the dj world.

these days that song is on an ipod or a phone

my back up is several ipods. I carry MP3s on my watch. The only CDs in my kit are Serato control CDs.

ok i said the physican medium is dead and you mention that people are using controllers....people are usign controllers to REPLACE the physical medium of CDs and Vinyl. And you said it yourself CD sales are dying, the surge in vinyl sales is one of those hip trends, its a skewed figure because the sales are up from death figures. The truth is inthe consumer market the medium most purchased are digital media players. IPODS are dominating the market and people will have CDs in their cars for a minute but even thats givign away to CD players with thumb drive and IPOD input slots. With the way msuic is released now vinyl is to bulky cumberson and inconvienient. Its way more convienient, efficient, and price plus to buy digital storage space and use a digital format

Ok, name ONE DEDICATED RECORD STORE that has opened in the last 5 years.

interesting contradiction there BUT, sure your selling more now than 5 years ago, its hip right now but i can gaurentee you vinyl sales do not make up a sizeable portion of the industry as a whole. I know there arent any nonflea market record stores in 1000 miles of me, and all the online record stores i buy my breakbeat records from are going all digital and giving vinyl away for less than cost

you answered it yourself here

This is simply a matter of the heart ruling the mind. Allow me to explain.

My first, third and fourth cars were Minis. They were, are and will remain classic cars that will always remain iconic and have a huge place in my heart. So when the last one rolled off the production line, the world let out a deep sigh and lamented the loss of this legendary car.

But then we just went out and bought other safer, economic and more reliable cars instead. I would have another one, but simply for nostalgic and romantic reasons. It is however a long way from being the best car on the road.

The fact remains that turntable sales are in the toilet, and while vinyl sales continue to grow, an increase in sod all is still sod all. We must also remember that vinyl has no relevance for new DJs. They download all their music and are looking for compact cost effective ways to play their digital music - not paying through the nose for bulky relics of a bygone age.

So our heart wants the 1200 to continue, but no amount of special editions and all too late features adding are going to save them. The harsh finical reality is that the masses already have turntables, are getting rid of them or simply don't want them anymore. And there are several viable alternatives to Technics. No really - there are.

The bottom line is err… the bottom line. Panasonic cannot produce Technics in the small quantities and make money. Parts suppliers cannot produce small quantities and make money and tooling needs to be replaced too. This all adds up to unsustainable production, sales, revenue and profit for a global corporation.

There is no romance, history or nostalgia on the Panasonic balance sheet. The numbers must add up, but they probably haven't for years now.

Oh, and 5 YEARS AGO, 2005, that was the HEIGHT of the CD era.

The only reaon you're selling more "Records" now, is because it's TRENDY (if it's a consumer...and WILL eventually Fade again...

And if you're a DJ, we need CV's.

Missing Link Record, right here in Arcata.

this is true people. time to let go and let the healing process begin....

ANTARTICA?

No wonder...

No seriously....

Link ?

Thanks for chiming in. I was wondering if you had read up here.

I respect what you have to say but I don't see people getting rid of their decks. I see people buying used 1200s and fixing theirs up. The only reason though is there isn't anything new on the market. I think Technics is in the dumps because it stopped innovating not because less people are using 1200s. Even the used price on ebay has gone up recently. People want 1200s. If Technics did come with the killer feature they could have a market with all those people who use 1200s but want one cable midi integration. There are 1.5 million sets out there that could be upgraded.

ALSO! Did you see the BS TURNTABLES THAT THEY'RE SELLING TO CONSUMERS?

Oh, man, I thought they were seriously kidding...

But you see MOST of them are USB ones, so they can go digital ANYWAY....

Numark TTX USB -no way. great deck 1/10th of the lifespan
Stanton ST150 -also nice deck. not entirely their design and still doesn't have the killer feature I want
Vestax PDT3000 also nice. midi in is tits but it is also an old chassic design with subtle upgrade and IMO ugly as sin.

no one has really innovated in this product class in the last 5 years despite the growing trend in vinyl DJs (DVS)

Who said anything about people GETTING RID of their Turntables?

They'll just use them until they BREAK.....

40 years later..

imagine Serato integration like the CDJ-2000 but spinning platter and colored vinyl; can still flip it over and cut up some Shibuya Breaks.

digital read outs on the deck.
cue buttons

come Skratchworx, you have to agree there is something there

I will disagree with that any day of the week. 1200's sales were about DURABILITY.

The question always was, "Yo, you're a DJ? Do you have 12's?"

and here's the proof that you agree with me Johnny

its both, djs who KNEW whats up bought them to be durrable....since ann the DJs people looked up to had techs the next gen out wanted them as status symbol probably not even knowing WHY it was they were clamoring for em

Again... I don't agree with this. Let's say that Technics adds MIDI to it... at the whopping price of a new turntable for $800 bucks. So, would you sell your old Technics and get the new MIDI 1200's for $800 when you can just buy say... the dicers for $90 and call it a day? lol

this came pretty close....

he already answered this here

PS... and it's indestructible not indestructable... lol

www.panasonic.com

But do the math... it ain't gonna work.

The ONLY way for Technics to make a come back is for them to spark INTEREST in people. That's it. You used to see Technics everywhere... now you see wanna b dj's in commercials fakin' the funk.

Of course, you also see commercials with people using turntables... usually fakin' the funk as well. lol

fixed

Durability didn't become a factor until AFTER DJ's realized they could leave the game and STILL SELL THEM for a good price.

When they FIRST CAME IT, you had to "Have 1200's" or you weren't a REAL DJ.

In all honesty I watched the ENTIRE 2 hour video of that last beezo battle...if thats our next gen of DJs then fuck it let the TT die because they aint usin it right anyways.

Just adding MIDI is not "REINVENTING" it.

THIS is a reinvente turntable
djbooth.cachefly.net

RIGHT! And if they would have come out with a VER 2.0, they would have cornered the market, JUST with the Brand Name...

But the Problems were too much to ignore for the diehards...

You can't reinvent something that is flawless, durable and perfect. Adding buttons to it will NOT bring it back to life.

what were the problems with it anyways?

That has EVERYTHING to do with WHY they can't get their SALES UP NOW, but has NOTHING to do with WHY the Sales were INITIALLY high.

Durability is proven over time.

New shiny sh*t is scooped up because, well, it's NEW.

theres to much that you have to constantly replace, vinyl gets worn, needles break, they are large, heavy, hard to transport, take alot of room to setup, have to be calibrated properly, are harder to work (with no relative mode)

Not true, the numark TTX wasnt out for a month before we know it wasnt durrable at all lol

i was refering to www.panasonic.com

oh, well i think it sounds HORRIBLE digtiallt when used for scratching and ive seen alot of videos saying it had horrible give on the platter, like you could move it alot without manipulating the MP3

i was refering to www.panasonic.com

At the TIME it was in it's Heyday, it was Flawless...

As for the NEEDS of TODAY's DJ, it can be viewed a being FLAWED, because it doesn't have what most DJ's look for in the Digital Era.

I mean, C'MON, REPLACEABLE RCA's should have been the 1ST UPGRADE.

But NO, if you weren't savvy enough, you had to bring it to a SHOP...

Same with the Pop-Up light. At one point, I was buying them by the 6pack because they kept giving me the wrong voltage. (ones with the RED WIRES vs. BLACK WIRES).

Do y'all know how many screws are on the back of that jawn?

Man listen...

from the research i did it wasnt so much that it was bad.....people who swear alligance to techs WANT TURNTABLES, their all purists, so people who wanted CDs went with the pioneer unit which i believe came out 1st anyway...i believe the CDJ was just better than the tech, pioneer builds bad ass CD players (car stereo and home stereo markets)

See, Technics was ALREADY IN FRONT OF THE CDJ GAME when it intially came out with this --->>>cgi.ebay.com.sg

There was no excuse not to refine what they did...

Actually no. Hybrids have been tried and totally failed in the market. Numark and Gemini had a go - flippable vinyl and everything - that played CDs and vinyl. Sales barely broke thousands on a global basis. Clearly nobody wanted them.

looks like my fax maxhine




a bit of research may help ;)

But they had a JOG WHEEL, and PITCH control...

Nevermind that it cost a 1,000 bucks...

Just sayin...

this hybrid would just be a TT with midi buttons. Loose all the CD parts.

and this is why those failed

man does that thing have a damn beta-max pop up CD drive...SWEET

I really rated the hybrids and so did Plus One from the Scratch Perverts. Seems we were alone though. People wanted to play CD or vinyl - not both.

they had a couple of those at a station i worked for in the 90's

The problem with this is your limiting yourself, lets say you put 5 buttons on it and next year serato puts 5 mew midi button features in the software..you STILL gotta get a controller! WHy not just keep your current table and buy a controller (lets say dicers), then when their outdated you toss them and get a new $100 controller with more buttons, knobs, ect ect.

so people want a turntable with midi buttons like a 1200 with the dicers built in?

Right, and that's what Technics was Famous for...

Studio/Radio Station quality devices.

the truth is most people who are all about buttons and knobs ARENT your TT enthuiasts to begin with, TT enthusiasts are typically purists.

CD players for DJs that emulated vinyl were a temp thing in my eyes

even Pioneer wants you to play digital files on their $1600 CD players

lol.

that they just released 4 new models of

hardware is getting faced out by software. EFX processors for example. Why buy an efx processor when the sofware can do it.

efx 1000 is like 800 bucks
efx in serato Free update, just buy a midi controller for far less and it's costume to your likings

I'm ready to flush mount some dicers into a deck (seriously)


I remember this one time... someone put a serato box INSIDE a mixer

oh and I also heard a story about midi controllers being added to mixers and the price doubled.

i remember that thread

dub.... I will use 1200 till i die and im with you (NH,NM) to keep this alive. I just want technics to keep the turntable but add what people want and expect out of the new technology.

I'm sayin, when they had stuff like THIS --->>> www.vintagetechnics.info

in the Radio Stations, you KNEW they were badazz.

How the HELL they gonna make a Turntable with no TONEARM?

Man listen...

Prestige.

Somebody already did the midi button + 1200's thing here...

yeah, same guy AKIEM

it didn't work, so we should just give up and stop trying huh....

More cool stuff!

www.vintagetechnics.info

www.vintagetechnics.info

www.vintagetechnics.info

akiem

Dude, you gonna be alright?

that was genius

LMFAO1

not until I get what I want

How you gonna co-sign yourself?

Yep, there it goes...but that's just their latest models, the older ones still needing time code CDs if you are using Serato...DEnon had that posibility since a couiple of years...

That was AKIEM over here serato.com < click

Ok, let's see...

You're the CV KANG...

Own a record store....

Currently have 12+ 1200's at the crib repairing them...

Yeah, you're in trouble if the TT industry goes belly up...

*****Guards, put him on Suicide watch...no sharp Vinyl edges near him please****

because AKIEM deserves props

of all those things you listed that one thing makes me the most $/hour

so no, I'm not in trouble if all we have is to repair old 1200s

flush mount dicers into 1200's is a good idea but your still going to need another midi controller for knobs. When such midi device comes out then what are you going to do with that hole you made into the 1200 that only fits the dicer. You are making the turntable a piece of hardware that will get faced out.

But say there were NO MORE 1200's to repair....

then we customize

research and developement


cut up another 1200

there are 3,000,000 out there

i just want a clean set of 1200's with a nice mixer with a solid Midi controller and i'm happy (NO numark,gemini, or any other crappy brand)

That's exactly how I feel!
BTW, all these crappy plastic controllers, how long will these toys last?
If a newbie get's this instead of a pair of used MK2s and a used mixer...maybe some of these guys will realize that those things are not all of that and buy turntables. Like other djs upgraded in the past from cheap gear to Technics turntables and a decent mixer.

fixed

okay, here is an idea

Serato interface built into the deck. Now connect the computer to the turntable and you can play any song through any mixer or any system. The interface is connected directly to the tonearm. Modular hub system so you connect multiple decks to draw from the same library.

After all, Scratch Live is emulating the deck portion of the DJ system, not the mixer portion.

The built in interface could also be used to emulate different cartridge/pre-amp combos to playback regular vinyl including those $5000 carts. There's your non DJ high end techie niche market right there.

like a V7 that plays records

im starting to minimize everything in my set up. I used to run an external drive, Everything was ok but having everything in your computer works a whole lot better plus one less thing to go bad,one less thing to logg around,one less thing to drop and risk getting damaged. So 1 midi controller along side a 57 or a 68,computer,stand, needles,headphones,vinyl ,1200's .

less is more

With a 68, I woulnd't use an additional MIDI controller.

true

I don't think I would lose my dicers because the placement is so ideal.

buddy of mine has an 800 with 2 channels dedicated to just midi and it works well. NO external midi. 2 1200's and thats it

i am in the process already,just bought 2 decks to do this,back in the 90's , hot jam's, a record store in chicago was installing reverse switches into 1200's to make the platter reverse direction just by reversing the ploarity to the magnet, so adding knobs for midi function along w/ a dicer in each corner would be fairly easy and neat!
btw dub, you really know how to start a thread,
word up
technic 1200's forever
real dj's use vinyl

www.trendhunter.com

that particular corner on the 1200 doesn't have a whole lot going, so it shouldn't be too hard. But the very tip of the corner has a one of the long bolts that might be hard to avoid. I'm thinking of just have a machine shop cut out the right size hole and drop it in.

either that or take the dicer apart and build it into the deck plate

machining a hole would be best i think,i know exactly what bolt you are talking about,
so you have the midi buttons covered,just the knobs,which midi being on the bus it would not be a big problem to put 5 custom knobs along the edge of the deck.
there you have it dub,1200 w/ midi,slap on custom black and red paint,some serato & technic logo's and your serato/technic 1250 just came to fruitition.
brilliant

exactly

Why would you ever build Scratchlive into a deck?

That's limiting the DJ's choice....(No Microsoft)

because that is the part it is emulating. if you want digital mixer, you got Itch.

despite the initial goal of Itch being an all in one solution with one to one mapping. The V7 broke those rules.

That product is what Scratch Live users have been asking for longer than I have been a forum member, but Itch got it first.


Watch, midi/TT hybrid deck is coming.

I feel that Rane/Serato will do a nice colabo coming soon on a super DECK!!

but first admit that technics is DEAD!!

they are not dead.

ha

I need help saving my turntable...everytime i play something on my turntable threw serato it wont give me a signal its just blank....what could it be??? do i need a need rca cable is it my needle??? please someone help??

like i said ,they have been saying that since 1996

wife told me 3 years ago she was gonna leave me if i kept cluttering the house with vinyl and equipment....she is still nagging me to this date but some day she will be GONE!!!

better her then the 1200's

lol

hahahaha

no offense bro, my old lady says the same stuff, just thinking what i want to tell her when she says that

just remember she will take half your shit

not the 12's

Keep the 12s she's taking half of your serato collection

I'm lost as to what the point of this thread is.

Divorce and ex's getting half your shit ^^^•

lol

oh, I was just trying to point out how old Johnny is....

lmao

Don't forget that Johnny started that religion thread and started it by saying:

"My buddy Jesus and I were at school one day..."

lol

seriously though.

I want a 1200MK7 aka make another turntable Technics. We've done the market research for you and for some reason we have we have ridiculous brand loyalty. You have already defied all the odds so do it again.

I seem to remember Technics having a go at CD decks... so even when the blueprint was there for them in the shape of the CDJs, they still got it spectacularly wrong.

Once thing missing from this thread is how bad Technics track record is for design. The 1200 was a lucky accident for them, but since then all other attempts at DJ products have been so-so at best. People only buy the headphones for the cool factor.

Gizmo.... I do you think someone will pick up the pattens of the 1200 and but a similar turntable?

but = build

As in toolroom patterns or do you mean patents? I believe the patent on the motor expired anyway.

Similar decks already exist in the shape of the super OEMS. The Stanton STR and STR8150 is seen as the logical successor because of its similar layout, but has all the features of an up to date deck (MIDI would be nice though). It wouldn't take much for Hanpin (the factory they all get their versions from) to make a deck sooo Technics like that you could barely tell the difference.

I could really get behind trying to save the 1200 if I thought they were the best, but I genuinely feel that other decks are superior. I see turntables as consumer units - if I get 5 years from them after a daily beating then I'm happy. It's just like replacing your TV or games console really. i get the whole craftsman looks after their trusty tools, but ultimately they are just lumps of plastic and metal.

patent .. sorry for the mis spelling. I have tried the vestax and stanton but i just did not like the feel (NM). Call me a fanboy, loyal to a brand but it's so hard to turn your back on a product that has been there night in and out for the last 17 years.

so what we want

1) make an up to date deck with improvements but keep the feel of a 1200
2) price point
3)strait arm please

My thing is this gizmo, If they slap a TECHNICS logo on a New turntable people will buy it!

but the new turntable would have to have more than a button to reset to zero, it would have to wow people and push turntables into this century. New look, new technology, same feel and built quality.

I do agree that there is some considerable room for advancement in turntable design - something that strict adherence to the Technics rulebook has held back - the undeniable fact remains that people aren't buying turntables anymore. So no matter how you dress them up, there simply isn't the market for them.

We're not talking about some new fangled device like an ITCH deck in a new market sector where the manufacturer hopes that people like them. The turntable market is established, with Technics taking the lion's share. And yet there still isn't enough sales for them. Sales are less than 10% of what they were 10 years ago.

too heavy
too old
too hard to maintenance (needles,cables,slip mats, control vinyl )
too easily replace by a cd player or midi controller

why the decline among djs gizmo?

I think you answered your own question. :)

got it

so why did I go back to them. Why did the bouncer at the bar who is buying gear this week ask me if he should get TTs instead of CDJs. Serato/Rane just announced that they will be used in the DMCS!!! Not CDJs, not midi Controllers...Serato Scratch Live used with Turntables. You cannot deny that the turntable is far from dead.

The low turntable sales numbers are because there hasn't been a new (killer) TT design not because people aren't using them. I'm watching used 1200s on ebay like a hawk. People are buying turntables.

The King is dead, long love the King!

But the difference is I HAVE moved on and embraced new Technology, but I can still send you a working Realistic if you like....

And I KNEW I should have rested on the "666th" day....

Ahhhh man, DON'T BRAND Technics as "So So" at best even though you're talking about JUST the DJ products.

Technics was into EVERYTHING...from Receivers to Tape Decks, to Equalizers, and had AN INSANE LIST OF PRODUCTS in EACH category.

www.vintagetechnics.info

Yes, that 1200 MKII was definately a DJ's dream, and an accidental blueprint that changed the world, but people don't realize HOW MUCH stuff Technics had under their belt.

I for one, remember the Tape Decks were to DIE for.

[quote}
so why did I go back to them.

Because you are a VINYL JUNKIE.

[QUOTE]
Why did the bouncer at the bar who is buying gear this week ask me if he should get TTs instead of CDJs.

Because you are influencing him



Technics just announced they are "discontinuing" development of the 1200. Why sponsor them anymore?



Again, what good is this doing anyone if nobody is buying them from Technics?

Plus there is still the "shock" and people are adjusting to the "no new Technics" news, and BTW, there is a recession.

Wow I massively messed up the quoting there! But you get the idea.

EXACTLY, in the last year ive ordered a few hundred dollars worth of vinyl (both CV and regular), ive had to order them because its is IMPOSSIBLE to buy it up front, the store the real vinyl came from is in miami and a few from ebayers and to get the good colored CV i have to order from the online stores because there the ONLY source. Over half of those came in warped and unuseable, also ive had to replace 2 needles.......NONE OF THESE ISSUES AFFECT DIGITAL MUSIC OR CD PLAYERS, if your busniess is DJing than these are really unnecessary expenses.

I read an article maybe last year about vinyl sales in Germany...they are a little up over the last couple of year...the rock bottom was like 2002 or something...the don't sell singles, they are really not selling, because the djs jumped to Serato and Traktor and ...but there are music lovers, collectors and freaks out there who are buying albums on vinyl and it hits even the younger generation now. But as I say this, I doubt that this really has an significant impact on Technics turntable sales, because if you are treating your gear right and just listen to the records at hom your turntable will last longer than the turntables in the clubs...so the current vinyl sales as they are don't really help the situation. I like Dubs idea from implementing the dicers into an MK2...I'm pretty sure you just gave somebody an business idea. Sad if Technics is not continuing the production of their turntables but what can you do, if you don't have the money to buy the whole plant and move it to your place? Convince them to change their minds and continuing the production of turntables? This is not gonna happen and I'm pretty sure, as much as I stick to their products, there will be sombody else who's making turntables. Personally I prefer to buy music novadays as a download or an cd, but if I don't get it this way, just on vinyl, than I'm gonna buy it on vinyl. It's just easier to rip a cd than recording the music from vinyl to turn it into an mp3...for my listening pleasure I record mixes and put them on my ipod...at the same time I'll have emergency mixes for the club, if my sytems chrashes...

according to my GC source (no necessarily the most reliable source ill admit) they wont sell it anyway. GC supposibly offered to buy the technics brand from panasonic and they eclined. Which leads me to believe there may be some plans down the road for a linmited edition table here and there

People laugh at & diss NUMARK, but products that are built NOT TO LAST keeps your company in business..

At the same time you lose business if your gear breaks down fast and is not relieable. Who wanna buy this crap? And on top it is a cheap brand too. Their marketing strategy is like we are the cheap ones, the others are too expensive.

thats a good marketing stratagey though because as a consumer base there are ALOT more broke bedroom DJs doing this as a hobby than pro DJs who can affrod $2000 for a pair of tables or $2500 for a mixer

The perfect business model is to build something that is RELIABLE for a specific period of time, and after that, EXPECT to UPGRADE...

Oh, and the UPGRADE has to be better than the ORIGINAL.

The point is lots of people keep buying their gear.. And when there gear does break down, their is something new and innovative from the company to replace it with..

Beginner only I would say...all the djs I know (no bedroom djs), not one of them owns something from Numark...the one or the other had maybe a piece of them in the past, in his beginner stage, but they sold it or smashed it into the garbage can.
Most of the djs here were tought by older djs, friends like buy Technics turntables, get them used first, if it's not for you, you still can resell them.

Believe it or not, Numark sells a LOT of mixers...

like you said beginers only....there are ALOT more beginners than there are pros out there

i have a numark mixer, 4 years strong and i love it, built in limiter, built in effects, 3 channels $300

I mean say Technics did decide to continue, to sell TT they will still be at sqaure one(losing money), because most new dj at not going to buy Technics anyways especially at current prices and no old djs are going to cop them either because their current techs STILL work..

Again, it depends on who's buying it, and what they're looking for.

When I finally made up my mind to upgrade my mixer from a Realistic, I bought a Technics EX/DX-1200 (the famous battle mixer). And got pinched by a fader that started bleeding in 2 weeks.

Returned it for one who's fader bled in 3 weeks. Sam Ash didn't do a return, so I already knew, going forward, that I'd need a mixer who's fader would last FOREVER.

So I went back to the Realistic, for years until I got put on to the Rane 56, and the rest was history.

I say all that to say, I KNEW the Rane product was a no-brainer, hell I have their AC-23 Crossover, and set it, and forgot about it.

I even bought a used backup, in case my primary failed, or I needed two separate 3-4 way setups.

I have NEVER used that Crossover.

You get what you pay for, and I paid for PEACE OF MIND.

Yep, you ain't neva lied...

we agree on this

Lets look at the recent BPM show.

DB4
S4

were the big items


DB4. Everyone wanted a Bridge controller. I see lots of people using the Bridge with turntables. That seems to be the big appeal...turntables + Ableton = the best of both worlds. The main features of the Bridge allow you to sync live production with a RECORD. If you want to sync with an MP3, you don't need the Bridge to do it.

The other feature, MIXTAPE is aimed toward vinyl DJs who want to edit their live performance. Again, making a mixtape with just digital files and all you have to do is throw it into ableton, no Bridge needed.

S4. I pointed out the Ean Golden example above. He helped design this thing and he prefers to use a homemade grid of arcade buttons. If he moves to the S4 I'll eat my words. The point I am trying to make, is that the S4 is a good piece of kit but its the same midi buttons and faders rearranged in a box that the industry has been trying to get right for 5 years. Meanwhile, many DJ top DJs have made a return of renewed commitment to use vinyl to control Serato. Midi controller are not new, they just keep getting regurgitated. When I met Ean 5 years we has doing the same thing he is doing today with a $99 2 octave keyboard.

I know why things are headed in this direction but I don't see them staying there. At the top end there will be DJs that just refuse to give up vinyl (Serato should have some good numbers for that). I see a lot of people saying that whole market is over but that is the stupidest thing you could tell me. I see more and more people every day spending $100-700 for a pair of records to use on turntables, you want to convince me these people don't have $ to buy an upgraded industry standard deck.

please...

last BPM expample..

PIONEER. What did everybody want to see...a controller. Instead Pioneer is pushing 4 new models of CD players that they want you to play digital files on. They missed the mark big time probably because they spent so much time and $$ developing the CDJ 2000, 900, 850, and 350 that they would cannibalize sales of all those if they dropped something without CD player parts in it. After all, CD players are one of their main consumer products and they want to keep selling those to DJs (even though they want you to hook the computer up and use Recordbox) I see a very confused and expensive product line.

So after BPM, my buy list didn't change.

more Technics 1200s
some Ortofon S-120s
Rane 68 (so I can mix 3+ TURNTABLES)
more records
new macbook pro in 2011

your still using MP3s for both of these and you can use both with some CDJs or a midi cntroller

but I CHOOSE not too

that a moot point. we are all playing MP3s. We make a choice as to what we control them with.

No they wont becaue A) They already have TTs that work and B)their spending all their $ on blank records......another thing your not adding is alot of these records being bought for $700 arent going to touch a TT, their collectors items

and thats fine you have that right and im making the same choice. it dosent change the reality of the market

I'll the first to admit the decks are all for show. I did a wedding a couple weeks ago and it was raining and my CDJs were being rented, so I used a nanoKontrol and rocked it.

However last Saturday when the power got knocked to set-up, I had a record playing as soon as the gear was plugged in because all I had to do was flip it over.

I mentioned extra ipods as back-up but in reality the back-up I use the most are a bunch of vinyl records.

yes, it does because no one is releasing any new products for us.

Lol - that's why I cut down on this - cuz after all they are only blank records..

because the "us" you are referring to dont produce enough money for a company to have that focus, if your name aint TECHNICS they aint buyin it and there arent enough people buying THOSE to keep makin em

for most of us though that wont help, how many hiphop\top 40 serato control tone vinyls are there?? the def jam...thats it. For most DJs young DJs they would be in a worse spot if soemthing happend to their CV or TT, they dont have ANY real vinyl for backup but they DO have plenty of CDs in the car, or an ipod

Bezzle, you use turntables right?

There is still a demand for Technics. Smart business, Take them off the shelves for a couple of years and let the world run dry of them. Put them back on the shelves in a new future generaton design. They will be working to build them and keep up with demand for the next ten years. " my hopes anyways"
Paid 650.00 apeice for new mg5's last year. Now at GC for the very low price of 1099.00 you can have 1.

yes, and true to what youve been saying i started out on cd players (pre serato) then moved to vinyl then to serato. I love the feel of playing on vinyl turntables. That said everywhere ive played out (in lousianina mississippi and north flordia) and every dj that ive spun with uses CDs, i very few if any DJs that still use vinyl. Most of them tell me that there are just to many possibilities for problems with needles breaking, records warping, headshell connections ect ect. Even people who come to see me spin comment about how theyve never seen a DJ spin with real records before. Now i know its different in NY and LA because you guys have historically huge turntable scenes out there but i think if you look at the market as a whole and what everythings leaning too its going away from tables, most of your new DJs dont even have turntables cross their mind and I know alot of cocky lil bastards who talk about CDJs the way technics users used to talk about CDJs.

Then you have to figure how many hobbiests buy shitty low wage crap cd players and controllers. There are a ton more hobiests now who go and just buy off price and what their getting are crappy cd players and controllers. My local GC hasent even had techs in stock for about 5 years, not because they sell out but because they couldnt sell the ones they had. They also have a rule to not take TTs back as buybacks for their upgrade program because noone buys them.

The art of the TT may not be dead but the the numbers are down, people in general are less interested in scratching, which is the sole thing that makes owning turntable a great purchase. It wont die any time soon because there ARE still scratchers and there ARE still purists ect ect. But i dont see any of that contributing to panasoncs bottom line in enough force to compete with their other product lines.

I disagree I think all taking them off the market is doing is causing a new generation to look at alternative means of DJing, people buy technics out of brand loyalty and if you do ANY research either by google or word of mouth all they do is bash ANY table but technics. So causing an enviroment where you CAN get techs is just gonna puch people to CDJs and controllers and oncetheir comfortable with those i dout their gonna switch their steeze back

no way. then why are all the used TTs being bought up

even broken ones are fetching double what they did 6 months ago

that trend will continue and Technics could very well come back out in a few years and we will still flock to them. I will never stop using them unless something better comes along. IMO the only thing that can beat this thing is another Technics with built in midi.

for the price of a new M5G you can get this bad boy

cgi.ebay.com

Gizmo's example on the Mini is perfect. The came back out with a new one and it seems to be doing well.

Volkswagen Beetle is another one.

Look what Rane did to the rotary mixer, maybe they can do the same for the Performance DJ Turntable. They did just become main sponsors of the DMC....

Some people are like you they know they will only use techs so their stockpiling them, but also because their cheap...look at this cgi.ebay.com


signed by GW THEODORE 34 bids and is still under 300 bucks

I'm not stockpiling them, I'm repairing them for other DJs like me who know that's what they want to use for another 20 years.

I do have multiple sets because I rent out turntables to production companies.

people are going to continue buying them used off ebay because its the cheapest alternative, i dotn see many people flocking to them at the $1000 price level when they could buy a CD or controller for a similar price

and what turntable manufacturer is making money from anything you just said

I think thats true to the new dj coming out and starts with whats out there. Regardless what someone ends up using. If they are a true technic die hard they will buy it. I could forsee atechnic model with a built in cdj along with the turntable bouth acting as one. Might even see where it has a usb for a hardrive to plug into. Pretty much close to the fail they did with there technic cdj. Ha Ha that says 1200 for the gold edition. I do catch people slipping on craigslist to this day selling them real cheap. As Im hording them and after I buy them I say you know these are discontinued right. Then I get that shocked look on their face. Alot of people still dont know whats going on yet. In the Northwest you can buy a pair all day for 650.00 with a mixer and cases.

I just got 4 tonearms and 2 Pitch Fader Knobs from Technics this morning

Also Panasonic still isnt making any money with the new 1099 pricetag. Thats this nations stores getting greedy for cheddar.

^true

ok so how much did those parts cost you??

about $200

and for that $200 they pretty much lost the sale of 2 turntables

not really, that's a customer that refuses to buy the alternatives