Something to compete with the Pioneer TORAIZ?

Roland + Ableton + Serato= BrIdgE

A mixer to clapback at Pioneer DJM-S9 & Rekordbox DJ.

See here: at least an hint: ask.audio
And here to get an idea of what AIRA is:
www.roland.com

…..waiting…..

This latest announcement with Serato and Roland looks interesting I'm a little excited but I'm not so sure I would invest in the buying any more hardware for these types of partnerships. They don't seem to last. Last time I did it, I spent a lot of money and the two companies involved, Serato and Ableton, dropped the ball and blamed each other for this failed partnership. So my advice is don't do it, they won't be committed to each other for very long and you won't get your money back that you have invested. What do you guys think??

it will be some AIRA rubbish.nothing like the machines of old

I second your opinion Micheal !
Also, there are other features required by user Serato should focus on rather than the FX area.
Quick wins not requiring any hard-to-maintain partnership.
I.e.: From the top of my head, the ones more attractive to me, multiple monitors support with detachables and resizables panels, and smpte/mmc/full midi support

I'm not dropping more

I like how the video admits it took them 2 years to figure out 'what' they should do together, after deciding it would be a good idea to get into bed as business partners, without any clue as to what the point / reason would be, other than trying to gain some more market appeal / share?

Considering the latest beta of Serato (or was it stable?) had a bug fix 'no longer will corrupt wav files writing tags / analysis' I think you REALLY need to worry about getting Serato DJ stable.

I am surprised how many reasons you can continue to provide for me to avoid SDJ still.

I wondered why I had something like 1000 new 'corrupt' wav files after re-scanning (as you previously recommended to do for new major versions!!). Not happy and as usual more reasons for me to avoid SDJ like the plague.

I would recommend you get what you've already got working better before adding a crap-ton of features that will just introduce more instability, higher software requirements and almost certainly more bugs.

p.s. guess what it will be a midi controller, or a hardware effects unit, or a combination of both. Something I have no interest or care for as I use turntables with SSL.

Considering Roland make hardware, it has to be some expensive hardware kit / midi controller. Which I don't use as my interface is turntables / mixer / laptop.

I hate all the stupid controllers coming out and how it seems like a controller supported 6-12 months prior suddenly is being 'superseded' by some new plastic gimmicky thing.

i agree that their testing is a joke if the wav corruption is back on the table, i had that in ssl 1.7, and if they even tested wav files themselfs they would have found the bug before release

i think the recent extensions of the sales show that the money isn't coming in as quick as they'd like it to so they extend the sales in hope of more revenue, could there be financial issues for serato, and there was talk not to long ago about the possible sale of serato,

and as far as this partnership its going to be similar to the bridge instead you will have a 16 bank sampler with layers linked to some midi controller that roland will make with 16 pads its the obvious thing this partnership will lead to

Yep it looks that way.. I really would just like the Bridge honestly. Not that I really understood it's significance, compared to just using the programs separately.. but it would be a nice reason for me to drop $50 USD on a 'plugin' ability for SDJ.. I have plenty of hardware and tools as a producer, I don't feel the need to further integrate SDJ into production personally lol.

The only thing I use SSL/SDJ for as far as production goes, is for playing frozen channels through as a source to go into my mixer, through aux sends to hardware effects then back to mixer and off to a separate recording desktop. I can use my CDJ for this though too and that's dedicated hardware... Serato having the benefit of playing higher frequency and bit rates though (OLD CDJ hehe).

Hmm hold on, I thought of one good thing. Maybe there will be some stem-ability update that comes from this for all users, hardware or no?

Also I found it really funny to get an email from Serato the other day suggesting I check out their 'friends' (I think it was) - stuff like Mix Emergency and Mixed in Key..

Any idea who is providing / making the algorithm used for SDJ key detection? I am surprised now they added the feature they are advertising Mixed in Key.. is that an admission MIK 8 is a better scanner than SDJ?

From my experience SDJ vs MIK 5.5, the only real difference I've noticed is one might suggest say a Dsharp where the other would call it an E flat.. which isn't much of a difference, unless you are talking the legitimate difference between flats and sharps, which is more an issue for classical music..

I have an idea for Serato to make money. Release Serato Scratch Live 3.0. Charge $40 upgrade (existing hardware/software owners) or $100 new for it. Make it an updated SSL 2.5 but with a few new features of SDJ but with continued stability of SSL. basically very few updates (like one per year or two) and not available for free, due to being a secondary product to SDJ.

I would pay $40 for an updated SSL.

I like that idea.

Would love to see a 1 deck controller with a motorized platter but after reading that Serato wants to get into production im thinking we will get some sort of Toraiz competitor.

Meh.

I give it two years before the partnership quietly ends.

That's what i'm hoping for, a reasonably priced and intuitive sampler sequencer workstation. Been waiting some time for the hands on reviews of the Toriaz to see if it's what i'm looking for, but I don't need the propriety Pioneer CDJ midi clock integration as I don't use CDJs, nor do I need Dave Smith's Hi and Lo pass filters and I don't want to pay megabucks for the extra features that i'll probably never use.

It'll obviously be able to lock to Serato's beatgrid, have pads for sampling and finger drumming, but this is a bigger tease than a Taylor Swift miniskirt.

+2 on the paid for SSL update too

It wouldn't be shocking if Roland were to eventually acquire Serato as they just did V-Moda. Certain that Numark will be paying attention to this Roland/Serato announcement.

Roland has produced some interesting sampling/remix tech over the years (SP series, Variphrase, RMix software,etc), so they certainly have the ability to create something progressive...so what direction will this partnership take? My guess is something that competes with NI and Stems. it would be nice if whatever hardware they release can function standalone as well as within a larger Serato workflow.

And to be clear, I wouldn't consider a Stems knockoff "progressive"...

Maybe Serato should invest more time on how to get rid of all the spammy posts that keep popping up.

+1 to that...

midi controller

I would love to see a motorized platter. Everyone is making a controller now. In the near future, there has to be another company willing to learn from the platter models released in the past 10+ years. Technics SLDZ, Numark CDX/HDX, Denon 3700...these are the ones I remember. Oh, and Numark NS6/NS7II. Maybe after the controller boom is settled, companies will see that there are still many DJ's who would buy a controller (Midi or not) that had the stability and function the other spinning platters did not. I'm banking on a Toraiz competitor as well. Pretty sure Roland isn't going to stray too far off of their product path.

Should be a large motorized controller, but doubt it is.

My guess is a midi interface.


My other guess
There is a LOT of Serato features that (would/should) translate well to sample based productions. Ive been making suggestions for years for features that would better integrate with production software.

But yeah, I kinda dont want to spend too much after I purchased (should have just 'tried') Ableton. Big fucking waste of cash and time :/

why is ableton a waste of time? its expensive as hell, so i can see the waste of money but still, highly useful .

Because everything Ive done in Ableton I already do in other software Ive owned for years. There is one thing I go to Ableton for, but Reason just added it. Im not knocking Ableton, its just I was already committed to other software. There is no way that I am moving forward with Ableton. So wasted money and time learning it...

yeah, its all pretty much the same, just whatever you feel the most efficient with

Guy kinda makes a point

especially with roland, they are quick in and out of products if it doesnt work out. hell even if it does work out, they tend to just keep putting stuff out and just completely forgetting about older gear. at least thats how it was when i was buying hardware up to about 2010.

VS-1680 should have kept mine

classic.

I own a fantom x6 and groove box which I really don't use as much since I'm full on ableton need now.

Whatever they come up with if its going to redefine DJing then it's probably either hardware or some sort of software link that allows you to use Roland's whatever with Seratos whatever. Yea I know that's vague lol

Seems to me Roland only does software to support its gear. So this must be a hardware. And if its supposed to be a big deal then its not a dvs box. That leaves MIDI, or maybe some sort of multi track. MIDI seems the better bet, or maybe its both.

The problem is, if its a break out box for MIDI, fine. But can we sync to Ableton, Reason, PT, etc. without a damn box?

Maybe its a video break out box?

It would be pretty cool if it was a MPC like box and you could do production on it from the SDJ environment. But that wouldnt 'change DJing forever' or whatever they said.


Maybe it does all that shit. And auto mixes, because the majority of "DJs" sound like iPods these days - that would charge the art of DJing....

With all this hype it better be good.

Seroland gold plated rca cables

most likely something 95% of us don't need or cant use

This. I'm interested, but doubtful.

Not really if you want to be technical about it every single piece of hardware that works with Serato is a "partnership" with another company. That's the basic layout of how Serato DJ software works. They make the software and partner with a hardware company to create something together. They are just particularly making a big deal out of this Roland partnership which is making it interesting for me personally.

I think your missing his point. You're right, all of those are partnerships but look at the track record. Serato partners with Rane, rane and serato fall out and now none of the rane gear you spent tons of money on will be compatible going forward. Serato partnered with ableton for the bridge. Serato and ableton fall out and now your bridge setup wont work with updates going forward. So now serato partners up with roland. I a year they wont be talking and whatevet gear it is suddenly wont be useable under the softwared "new architecture"

I'd like an 808 with onscreen sampling, looping, editing, mixing and two motorized platters on each side to DJ with and to scratch your created music via the 808. #noairhorn

It's called burning bridges. #badpun

The partnership between Serato and Rane isn't any different than the partnership with Numark, Denon, Vestax, Pioneer etc. I wouldn't even say they fell out because Rane continued to make hardware for them until they decided to sell which really has nothing to do Serato. Even with Pioneer which looks like they won't be making anything compatible with Serato anymore and that's because on the software side of things they wanted to do their own thing with following Serato's roadmap and they are one of few companies that have the resources to do so. Now I can definitely agree when it comes to Ableton with the bridge but that was more software based trying to get 2 pretty different pieces of hardware to work together that just didn't work out in the end. As with this Roland partnership I won't have a true opinion until they unveil whatever it is they been working on but I can say I'm excited to see because Serato is making a pretty big deal out of it to even say "This will redefine what it means to DJ." That's a pretty big statement in my opinion so I'm very interested to see what comes out of this.

Though this makes sense from a world domination stand point, I don't think it makes much business sense, yet... Pioneer would be inviting a loss in market share to other companies by trying to strong arm cats. Though a lot of ppl complain about serato, there is a large amount of silent supporters. I think pioneer will just show preference to Rekordbox 1st then serato 2nd

Its word for word what they said before releasing the bridge

It makes great busniess sense when you look at how much hardware they make in house vs how much serato makes. I dont care how many silent supporters serato has, it wont make much difference when their buggy software wont be compatible with any of the pro level hardware being produced

Serato has been pretty stable with Pioneer hardware.

full use of the sampler ....
live music production ..
Record directly into sampler like Traktor.
8 channel Midi control sample arranger .. Roland
record from cue direct into the 8 channels sampler.

You can remix and mashup everything live on the fly

True but when you compare the "Big 3" (Serato, Traktor, Rekordbox) Serato has always been the most stable software and the most versatile as far as hardware choices. Nobody else has support from basically every big DJ company.

Though with Pioneer looking like they basically doing their own thing it looks like the last good piece from them for Serato will be the S9. That could be a big hit to them with Pioneer being the club standard. I still also kind of agree with Robbie. Before it could easily be said that Pioneer had the best lineup of controllers for Serato. Now they basically made a copy of all them and locked it into RDJ and doesn't seem to be too quick at all about even having their CDJ/DJM lineup being supported by software that isn't their own. That is where I feel they are making the mistake a CDJ and mixer should be supported by other major software because sorry not everybody is switching over to RDJ I know I'm not anytime soon.

It would be interesting to see if Serato ever does start producing their own hardware with all the people they work with they should have some type of idea of how to make a good piece of hardware but it looks like they really just want to focus on the software side and leave the hardware making to their partners.

With all that being said trust me if whatever comes out of this Roland partnership sucks then I'll be one of the first to tell the truth on it. Hopefully they give us something worthwhile.

Mabye in 2008. SDJ is in no way the most stable or versatile. I have not used rekordbox but traktor blows it out of the water at this point in both areas.




Well neither does serato at this point. And if your making everything in house (hardware/software/accessories) then you dont need support from other companies

Serato has been pretty notorious for being stable software. Now I can say that SDJ isn't as "stable" SSL but let's be honest here SDJ is doing way more that SSL when you really look at everything that is has to do. Now if you have the right specs and you're system is optimized and you're having issues then I can understand if not then you're not making a point.

Traktor has never been "known" for being the most stable and at this point they are so much in their own lane just doing things like stems that most DJs aren't even gonna use unless you're a producer type DJ. I feel like Serato can be used and is built for just about any type of DJ to use. Traktor is more versatile how? Just because it can use any hardware as a sound card? Again let's be honest with any of the Big 3 if you're a professional DJ you're going to use hardware that was built for the software if you want it to be stable and work well while you're trying to make your money. So you're going to use "Kontrol" hardware w/ Traktor, a supported controller for Serato, and a Rekordbox controller with RDJ if you want it to work well.

Serato is more versatile because it has hardware from different manufacturers giving you more choices and they are built for SDJ plug and play no fuss. I don't really have time to pick up a controller or mixer and "try" to make it work. NO software is perfect every one has bugs but I definitely have a much easier time with SDJ which is important when you have to rely on a piece of software to do your job.

The only company they don't have support for right now is Pioneer and technically they still have them because they still have current hardware that is supported i.e. S9. Everybody else is kind of doing their own thing. Traktor seems to be only focused on the electronic producer turned DJ just look at their hardware recently no platters which means no love for the open-format club DJs and definitely not the hip-hop guys which is where most of my work falls into. RDJ could end up being major just because it's Pioneer and they have a lot of resources but time will tell I can't really call them right now. I have always felt like Serato connects with the culture and tries to make something simple that every type of DJ can use. Just my opinion though I know SDJ pretty much inside and out & it has been solid for me all these years and provided me with the best options.

and you make a great point as well.

lol true and then they get Jazzy Jeff to vouch and we buy in.

I think the partnership between Pioneer and Serato is done heres why.

Pioneer is mostly in direct competition with Serato for Software and Rane for hardware.
Rane made all the dope gear we loved and Serato was just the software
Maybe Serato smelled that Rane was going to go out of business so they started collaborations with new vendors.

Fast forward Pioneer was in all out battle with Rane for hardware it was tit for tat. Rane's pockets just couldnt compete with Pioneer they took so many customers with their controllers.

Here comes the 62, game changer
Then bam came came rekord box game changer
The 57Mk2 and those other 4 Channel rane mixer's came out but got ignored mostly
Pioneer starts crushing with controllers everywhere
S9 comes out, by by Rane 62
Rane runs out of funds to compete with Pioneer they couldnt retaliate so instead of filing bankruptcy they sold the company to avoid totally loosing everything they initially invested when starting the company.

Theres so many business and life lessons in here its amazing.
Pay attention

Stay woke...lol

Very true kind of sad really I would always pick a Rane mixer over a Pioneer. The only Pioneer mixer I've ever really wanted has been the S9 because well hell that thing is a beast lol. With that being said once it's "out of contract" with Serato it will get full support for RDJ or Pioneer will just release a R9 ***rolls eyes***

Serato did all the work + Ableton made all the money = The Bridge

They won't make that mistake again.

Do you even see how much of what your saying contradicts itself?

Rane started in 1981. I'm pretty sure they made back all their initial investment money and more. If not then they were running a pretty bad business and should have shut down long ago.

Not anymore lol

Or rane....or native instruments. Pioneer is the only one that really matters right now anyway.


Serato is on its death bed, because as you pointed out




So whos gonna build hardware for serato? Pioneer isnt, they will be focusing on RB and trying to sync setato (hehehe puns). Native instruments wont, they will be focused on traktor and trying to sink serato. Rane has already been snubbed by them plus they arent going to be the leading name on quality they were after being bought by numarm.

So whos building all this cutting edge hardware thats gonna keep serato in the drivers seat, roland? Whats their track record on dj software? You dissed on traktor for focusing on "producer" djs. Do you NOTthink thats where seratos going by getting in bed with a company that makes PRODUCTION hardware?

Serato is not on its death bed. More like a risky emotional teenager.

i dont think it was the profit margin of the bridge or any of that with serato, it was just a different way of thinking.

at some point, prob when the orig guys left or split or whatever, they realized they had to monetize, which is why we've seen charging for features like the bridge.

ill assume that at some point there really was a thought of keeping things cheap and based on the professional dj, which it isnt now.

most likely they werent making any money and someone told them they better or go out of biz. now the product is ok, but not what ssl was.

imo serato is just looking for a buyer to cash out before they lose all their business to pioneer and native instruments.

just my .02c

I read an article some time ago about NZ infusing the company with some large amount of cash... my guess is they won't sell anytime soon.

I thought The Bridge was free?

Ableton hardly did anything. Serato developed it (mostly) Lots of Serato users purchased Ableton, I doubt very many if any Ableton users purchased Serato. :/

This Roland thing will probably work better for them...

I'm saying that's Traktor main focus with every software feature they add and the hardware they put out. Stems and hardware with no platters? These are the new things brought to us by Native Instruments. That's a pure focus on one type of DJ and if you're that type of DJ then cool for you but that still means that you pretty much put that software in a box on it's own. They haven't brought anything new to the table that pretty much any DJ can use. Things like Flip, PNT, and FX of course are things that any type of DJ can use. Serato isn't putting out major features that obviously are aimed at one type of DJ. Now with RDJ that could be a different story but I can't say on that right now from what I see it's still buggy and there isn't any major software differences it's really more so the ecosystem that would make it appealing to certain DJs.

Like I said before Pioneer doing their own thing could be a major hit because they have the resources to do so much. At the same time I'm really tired of Pioneer being looked at the only damn company in the industry. They have a standard not the best stuff. If I was to buy a controller today as a guy who uses turntables I would get a Numark NS7 2 or 3 any day over a SX or SZ. To me and even other guys I have spoke with it's much more accurate and personally a better pleasure to use. For mobiles I would choose to get a Denon MCX-8000 over a SX as it offers more I don't have to always just go with Pioneer and I feel like what they are doing is trying to force everybody to use their stuff. They basically copied stuff that was already done by Serato and Traktor. When they released the CDJ-2000 they was all about "no laptop." I guess they seen how well they did in the controller market which is still thanks to Serato and now have changed their perspective and want to be greedy and take over everything.

On the mixer side of things I'm sad af Rane left because that was the best alternative at least in the same price range. I even choose Denon mixers in the past before buying a Pioneer mixer because they had the same features if not more and cost less.

On another not in reality the mixer market as a whole has lost to the controller market which is sad to me because even though there is a couple of real good controllers out there I still haven't seen something that can be called a "standard" because nothing has truly yet come up to the reliability of a well built mixer with turntables or CDJs. Alas with controllers being so popular now companies that made real mixers that was all different from each other in some type of way which made it fun (Denon, Vestax, Rane, etc.) have either fell under or are now pretty much forced to focus on controller products or go out of business. The industry as a whole is what has put Pioneer ahead because they are the only ones now making a mixer.

Maybe that will change and who knows might come with this Roland partnership.

Just because Roland has never really made DJ gear doesn't mean anything. Particularly for controllers. Maybe its a controller, looper thing, with 8 channels and midi.

This but alo it might be a mixer as well.

I think its a mixer with sequencer built in and on board effects.

Very true, and they are also all features that serato copied from traktor. Flip is a less featured version of traktors remix deck. PNT was def seratos but at the end of the day its just
advanced time stretching and tracktors FX are much better and more flexible than SDJs

I don't think Flip can be compared to Remix Deck I feel they are 2 very different things. Flips are automated non-destructive edits to a single file. Remix decks are more like having a mini-Ableton in one of the 4 decks which is another example of why I said Traktor is very much pushing towards one type of DJ which is the producer who turned DJ or the DJ who also produces and wants to incorporate that into their set. As for the FX I have always heard Traktor effects are killer I might have to look back at that comparison video DJ Tech Tools did a while back.

Allen & Heath
Numark
Denon
Rane
Mixars

As far as the Roland thing, maybe they are going to integrate Serato DJ with the Roland Aira MX-1 and call it a day.

throw a cross fader on it...

Might as well add fisher price to the list

Why is that? Allen & Heath makes great high end mixers. Mixars could handle the mid-range offerings and Numark would handle the entry level products. Nobody knows the status of Rane and Denon at the moment but I don't think they are out of the game yet.

Exactly Bezzle do you not like Serato or do you have a preference for everything outside of Serato? I'm not even being funny I'm seriously asking because Rebelguy just gave you list of manufacturers who aren't new to the game and making good stuff but that doesn't seem to be enough.

IF allen and heath wanted to make a mixer for serato you'd have a point there. but Mixars has yet to prove themselves, numarks garbage and like you said we don't know what the deal is with rand and denon.....

Allen & Heath has three mixers that are currently supported by Serato DJ. They aren't specifically made for Serato but realistically Pioneer only has one mixer that they made for Serato, the S9.

that goes with my point

Your right but it doesnt mean you still cant loose everything if still go out of business after you made your funds back.

This makes the most sense why would they leave the business, they had healthy competition to keep them interested and motivated to make great products.

It had to be a money thing in my opinion they made top notch gear but didnt have those super budgets like Pioneer and now Native Instruments. I just think they realized keeping up would cost them more than what its worth seeing as how the Raen 68 and 64 didnt do so well. Hell the 61 and 57MK11 didnt really do so well still great products at the end of the day

I know if Serato doesnt do something Im probably going to start using Rekord box with DVS and just use my SL3 because the Pioneer ecosystem like someone mentioned is everywhere.

Its like I cant get away from Pioneer unless I bring my own and Ive finally realized that bringing your gear to the club just makes you look like a damn noob and everyone hates it unless your the only DJ all night.

It's sad really I personally wouldn't want to switch. When you been using a piece of software this is the foreground for your work that you know inside and out it's hard to just switch to something that hasn't even been out for a year yet (RDJ not Rekordbox as a whole). I don't know RDJ like that and it's crazy for me to think that I need to learn it just because of one damn company that has a "stronghold" on the industry. I would rather just bring my SL3 box when I come into a club with a NXS2 setup for instance. Hopefully Pioneer will give support for the DJM/CDJ lineup so people can still use whatever they want.

If you're a DJ in the clubs regularly they want to use something that they know to get their job done and perform at their peak. I don't see guys like Jazzy Jeff, Byte, Four Color Zack, Z-Trip, Scratch Bastid, etc. switching over because they been using Serato for years like a whole bunch of other DJs but hey just like them they cool with using Pioneer equipment that works with Serato and be just fine with that of course i.e. PLX-1000, DJM-S9. I'm the same way hell I want a S9 but say if it was released for RDJ only when it came out then to hell with it I'm using software that has been stable for me since day one and giving me the features I feel that any DJ can use.

Frankly the only people I feel would need or want to switch to RDJ would be DJs who was already using Rekordbox as a backup or for short sets in the club with CDJs. Those DJs have become familiar with the layout so it's not that big of a switch for them. Others like me might just see Rekordbox as something I can throw a crate or 2 into and have some songs ready as a backup and frankly unless I plan on doing a set a I really don't even have to put them into Rekordbox just put the songs on the stick and call it day incase something happens with the laptop.

Eventually something has to happen I know SSL won't run forever because I'll eventually get a new mac and I produce my vst's are starting to require a higher Operating system and a lot of my audio tools only work on 10.10 and higher.

Im staying SSL for as long as the technology will allow but being a producer too with one computer for both I know its the beginning of SSL's end

Still not liking SDJ that much it just not as smooth.

Rekord box the few times I used it was very smooth easy to organize my tracks. I havent used the DVS part I'll get a license soon and test it.

Im hoping serato can hold on trust me

NAILED IT!

Yup

What kind of computers you guys running where SDJ isn't running smooth? Now I have pretty speced up MBP but it's even old from 2011. Without running internal effects and PNT I can even run an older version of SDJ on a old ass white Macbook. Everybody keeps going back to SSL. That's like going back to any old version of any software that doesn't do as much and complaining that the new version is running your computer harder. Well the newer version is doing more even if you don't realize it and even to today Serato makes strides to make it run as smooth as possible.

thats the issue swann, some people are running powerful computers and having constant problems, some are using old computers with no problems. some are using A hardware fine but B and C hardware doenst work.

inconsistency is the problem.

One of my dj homies is running a macbook from 2015, Yosemite, maxed out ram, SSD pro, just uses it for djing, does not use fx, pnt, flip ect ect....and his crashes at MINIMUM once a weekend




I develop software in my day job and i can tell you that if i put out a new piece of software that is "doing more" and putting more strain on the computer to do an identical task as the previous software...i failed. Thats why i ride serato so hard on this, id give em a pass if they were blazing new trails and their software was buggy from being in uncharted waters, but killing a rock solid piece of software to replace it with the exact same software that is 100 times less reliable is absolutely unacceptable. That would be like facebook sunsetting facebook.com to make facepage.com which look exactly like facebook but charge you per post and crash everytime you tried to share a pic



Thats all well and good...do you tell people on the mic that while your waiting for sdj to reboot or do you just tell em after the show.

I don't have any issue I was asking an honest question based on my personal experiences. If you have had consistent issue with SDJ then trust me I could totally understand where people are coming from. If any issue I do have is putting trust into another software that hasn't even been out a full year yet just because it comes from Pioneer like they are the God of all and whatever they do is like automatic gold. I'm sorry if I"m siding with the company that's been looking out for the DJs for years and not the company that's just been putting out products that actually appeal to a DJ like me within the last year or 2 (PLX-1000 a good simple turntable that looks and feels very similar to Technics and the DJM-S9 the only mixer that has been able to touch my solid Rane 62.)



I see what you're saying with you being a person who actually develops software. I just think that still it has to be understood that even though it might "look" the same it's not. Now I haven't been able to test RDJ on a full set just kind of messed around the trial a couple times but if your computer can't handle SDJ I doubt it would run that much smoother on RDJ but if it does for you then hey it works for you.

It's just crazy to me that everybody is putting SDJ down for what? Serato was king then all of a sudden Pioneer decides to release RDJ and now it's "game over" for Serato? I don't see how that is because it's not like my Serato just stop working I'm using it every week a lot of times on different pieces of hardware with no problems. Pioneer releasing RDJ didn't change that fact at all. Every software has bugs you're not going to switch over to RDJ or Traktor and have the best of time without any problems it's just not going to happen.

+1000!!!!

You have to look at the marketing approach to make the best guess.

The are talking about #909 for the release date of 9th september... 909 was the famous drum machine of roland. They hinted that they would come up with a new version of the TR-909.
On the Roland X Serato Site, there's a green line. Green is the colour of the AIRA line of products.

Serato talking about new ways of djing that will change everything. I'm guessing some kind of Bridge system between Serato and the whole Line of Roland's AIRA Products.

They will come up with the new TR-909 and a bridge system with Serato that allows you to couple and sync serato with every AIRA module.

Basically it's their answer to NI's Maschine.

Its just not as good, when searching for songs it types slow and its little choppy. So lets say I type in "Desiigner" The D -E -S will type in normal then there will be a breif 2-5 second pause then the rest of the word will type out then search. Ive missed so many cues in the club messing with SDJ because it jus wouldnt search fast as I could type.

USB drop outs are pretty constant too at least with me. I have 2010 Macbook pro but its fully maxed out for its model 16GB with i5 its not the fastest but can run SDJ it just has some problems I dont know why it does.

Absolutely right, SL was stable SDJ is not. At the end of the day the absolute basic use for both softwares is the same: to mix 2 songs together. If it cant do that reliably then i dont care how many bells and whistles you add. A better metaphor would be a car. What serato did would be like taking in your reliable car that never gave you a problem and trading it in for the newest version but now it only gets you where your going half the time and when you take it to the dealership to get fixed they keep telling you they dont have time to fix it because they are to busy adding shoddy aftermaket parts. What your saying here is "of course the cars gonna gonna stop on the highway, its running neons and has a 1000 watt amp" which is great but dosent help me getwhete im going.

For being shoddy software?



No, scratchlive was the king, serato killed the king, thats where the game went up for grabs



Hard to argue this because your not using words correctly. First off your "serato" never worked because serato is not a software. Now, if your talking about scratchlive, then go ahead and update to the newest mac os and tell me it dosent stop working. If your on sdj, then for alot of us, it does stop working....alot. So yes. Pioneer releasing RDJ didnt cause any of that BUT before RDJ there was only 1 real alternative. Now there are multiple alternatives that offer everything serato does. Not only that but both of the other alternatives make hardware as well so things will work better and for longer periods of time. Not only that but Pioneer has a great deal more financial resources to sink into making their software great

:-)

Funny, the video ends with "World class software meets World class hardware".

Hardware yeah but world class software? I would say ok software but World class? C'mon.

Im using SDJ until I see RB being good enough for full time use. Being forced to use it now as a back up for USB when SDJ wont play nice have had me frustrated for some time now. I don't really care what it is as long as it works. SSL did it and did it good. SDJ did ok then not and then ok again and then there was an update and nothing worked and then it sort of worked, wtf...

This Roland/Serato thing better be a fucking miracle that blows everyone away.

Maybe a mixer that puts RANE and Pioneer to bed with built in auto updating code midgets that writes code on the fly for any system with a touch screen and it's own operatingsystem from outer space done by aliens who built the pyramids and now came back and blessed Serato and made the DJ world go, WHAT!!

Don't need another HW, I just need a stable version of Serato. Please!

"World Class Hardware meets struggling to get it right software"

Truth in advertising (or is that too harsh)

The definitive answers to whatever this thing will be is; simply the latest in the long line of colorful items DJs will point too when complaining about whatever super basic feature needs fixing.

Like why can't I control pitch from any damn midi controller in INT mode?

I can think of a few scenarios where this might be necessary. Tracking, security, encryption, sorting, traversals. Just saying, it really depends on the context of the software you are working on.

Ok damn let me "use my words correctly" that everything you quoted me on I was talking about SDJ. I use now SDJ every week with no major issues like crashes and I've been using it since 1.6 when I was able to use it with my Rane 62. SDJ was king because it had support from every major DJ company. Native Instruments has been making it's own hardware and still more people even today use SSL or SDJ. They didn't magically take over because their software even though it does same basic thing is still overall aimed at certain type of DJs via it's major feature sets. So that point is mute. Now like I said I'm speaking on my experiences and I haven't had any major issues with SDJ. I've had little here issues here and there yes but I also had it with SSL.

The same people that used to even complain about SSL having issues even up to the last version 2.5 all of sudden say it's perfect. Everybody switching their opinion when they want something to complain about. If SDJ isn't running that well for you for good reason then I already said I can understand your point and hell I would feel the same way. Hopefully some other alternative will work for you I can only speak for myself. At the end of the day any software is going to have some type of issues SDJ has them and so does Traktor and RDJ. SDJ on the regular doesn't give me any major issues where it's unusable to me. Any software has the potential to crash even if it has been used a hundred times before that with no issues. That will put you in a bad situation so when you ask me if I'm tell my crowd something when/if my software crashes I won't have to tell them anything because I keep backups on hand to keep the music going which is something you should be doing no matter what software you're using.

Traktor was never "known" for being very stable and it's workflow is too different for me. That plus a few other things about it puts it outside my radar but that's me it might be different for you. RDJ would be the best alternative but honestly can't trust it yet. First off the current hardware I have isn't supported and I'm not buying new hardware just to "test" something. So with that I do keep a very good eye on it because it has major potential. Pioneer better be glad they are Pioneer as in with the resources they have because the already had to fix major issues like 2 or 3 times that literally made it unusable to ALOT of users forcing them to back to a previous version. That's not really a good look for something that hasn't been out for a year quite yet and that's my best alternative? To me it can't be trusted yet but I'm keeping an eye on everything and see what everybody brings to the table.

Until then I'll be using the software that has been stable and worked for me. I'm excited to see what comes out of this partnership but if whatever comes out of it sucks then it sucks and I'll be disappointed but hopefully that won't be the case.

I can understand that I have a 2011 MBP maxed out that might be why I don't have many issues but I can see your frustration if it was me I would feel the same and probably have the same opinion about SDJ.

Not gonna lie, that right there was funny

Lol, fair enough, so which did serato add to sdj...
encryption? Tracking?

Gotta be encryption with how slow SDJ is. I know as a I.T person I hate when someone says something is slow and its not really slow they are just impatient. However I know better than that and the benchmark was set with SSL.

Lol, yup

Higher PPM. Moar Pulselockers per minute

Lol!!

Love it!

It's probably going to be an extended hardware version of our Sampler (formerly SP-6) to compete with the Pioneer one. 1.9.3 beta has a Sampler update in it, which I found odd given that it wasn't something that got a lot of feature requests on.

It used to get a lot of feature requests till it was clear they wernt going to touch it. And they havnt touched it since it was in beta. (till now)

Thats what I think its going to be too - Multi Track DJing

Ahh. Yup, makes it seem strange that it's getting an update out of the blue, till this.

I can say with a fair amount of certainty that whatever it is (its prob a hardware sequencer for live remixing) when its announced 75% of djs will be like ehhhh ok moving on. 20% of djs will cum on themselves and preach about how this will change EVERYTHING....then proceed to play the same uninspired track in track out set they are playing now and never use it. The remaining 5% will put it to use on some interesting ideas but it will never work quite right enough to make it outta the home lab outside of a glimmer of greatness in a 500 view youtube vid

You mean the $600 midi controller that i use to do tone play on 2 out of my 40K songs was a waste of money?

Lol!! Nailed it

Reading some of the 'Rane is finished' posts........ Well, Chris Karns posted a pic of himself outside of Rane HQ around a couple of months back, which got me thinking they were working on something pretty special, so I think Rane are still in the game and working on a new mixer.

Lets see a pic of Chris Karns (or anyone) at Rane HQ today...

Updated for the times. Dude karns was probably there to pocket some knobs and fader caps while he still can

Rane is done son :(

it's the minority having issues that are the loudest.

I've been using SDJ 2-5 times a week generally doing 4-8 hour gigs on a variety of gear including controllers, mixers, and boxes, and since 1.7 I haven't had any more issues than on scratch live.



Rane was sold to inmusic 2 months ago and they gutted the company completely. Fired everyone except a couple of key engineers, and shut down the washington HQ and manufacturing plant.

A Rane made in China is not a Rane to me.

Yep...

Nooooo. Sad news about Rane. Surprised this thread is the first news i've heard about Rane's demise. I checked their Wikipedia entry yesterday and all looked well. No mention of the takeover.

Whoa. That's news to me.

it was all over this site and most DJ communities and sites when it happened.

I was legitimately shook at the news as were a lot of us.

Sorry, I meant the gutting of the company. I heard about the acquisition, didn't hear about what they did with it after.

whatever it is, theres not way it can live up to the social media hype. ive never seen as many facebook ads for a release ever

new TR-09 and TR-03 from Roland,

www.factmag.com

Also Roland System-8

www.sequencer.de

Hmm. If all it does is lock to whatever device that would be disapointing. If it locks key, loops and cues, that would be interesting.

Whats 'Sampler' for tho?

If this is midi locked in with only Roland hardware, that would kinda suck.

Doubt it, but if I could get loops to my 505 Loop Machine...

i'm sure there will be more hardware, that just looks like the new gear from roland and i reckon they will have a few more bits that are the roland/serato hardware

Watchplayer.vimeo.com

notice at the end how the 4 efx buttons are all pioneer type efx?

I though the same but TBH it is both effective and familiar but in all honesty there are only so many ways a dedicated (printed text on button itself) button can look. Even the Akai AMX/AFX, new Denon, Numark controllers etc. all have similar buttons. Not all say the exact words but the point remains............

Same concept where a performance pad can really only look so many ways but being universal and familiar is typically an asset.

yeah, just the names jet and dub echo are pretty common to pioneer mixers. the other two have been on other dj products but are also on pioneer mixers. ill guess we find out soon enough.

I am not sure what is new in that video. It just looks like the following surrounding the computer:

Aira MX-1 static.roland.com
System-1 static.roland.com
TB-3 static.roland.com
VT-3 static.roland.com
TR-8 www.polynominal.com

Honestly I think that is just a "coming together" type of shot and I think the only new footage is the FX button view mentioned above.

Is anyone else here being really cautiously optimistic in that you're excited but also not going to be surprised if this turns out to be something completely lame...?

I'm already disappointed... Nowhere to go but up

I'm betting we get serato's versions of stems.

I hope not. If Serato gets involved with STEMS I hope they are..................... stems. They are supposed to be universal and IMO the last thing we need is yet another format. I have amassed a very large library of stems and this would break my heart.................. and wallet LOL.

And like Traktor stems, they'll cost a bomb to get all of, probably.

Another shot in the dark...Roland sequencers integrate with SDJ. SDJ allows input for Roland instruments and looping functionality + ability to apply the usual serato functions (auto loop / loop roll / slicer / etc) to said input ?

thats what the vid looks like, like a live pa for the 2010s.

I think it has DJ mixer functionality based on teaser video 2...

Just the way they using it

I just hope the announcement is more exciting than the Apple snoozefest from today. Zzzzzzz

Wonder if it's some sort of melodic scratching tool...

I bet it a mixer of some sort.
at the end of the video it's pretty clear there is 4 channels, a master and some effects buttons in the middle. I would bet 4 faders as well.

I agree........ For one of them at least. Thing is Roland has a placeholder for three products tfr.roland.com a.) b.) and c.) so I would assume there will in fact be three products announced hopefully all three involving serato.

Roland has -31- placeholders. I think I can't be the only one that gets a little nervous when a company is potentially going to launch 31 new hardware products...

Yah but only three are "dj" related and serato has/had much influence in the direction and planning. That being said I completely understand where you are coming from. Some will be smaller things anyways like headphones and such I suppose.

Dont care getting a Pioneer DJM 450 they won Serato's days are numbered looking at the stock market they dont got the guns to run with Pioneer. Roland is there closest fiscally this partnership is out of survival of Serato's product. Roland is really taking the risk with their brand.

Im just looking at the market here.

Rane sells the company to Inmusic and their parent stock company buys more private shares so they believe in their value that Rane added most likely.

Pioneer is rolling right now and I cant see what there DJ arm is doing but the companies overall finances are crushing.

Roland stock is trending positively which also means they believe in whatever products they have in store for their brand they believe in it clearly just look at the insider trading they aren't exactly selling there companies shares off.

So its going to come to financial shoot out for the customers dollars.

DJM 450 comes out only cost 699$ and is basically a 2 channel Nexus mixer which also makes finance headlines so investors are going to buy in just to see what happens. Pioneer rarely gives us anything cheap that you actually want.

Serato isnt on the market I think they are private so there is no telling really whats happening with them. Its a numbers game if you want Serato to live then you have to support there new products wether you like the products or not or else Pioneer will swallow up whatever market is left and Serato will be forced to target a new customer if they want to stay in business.

Just my 2 cents guys

I still cant wait to see what they come out with.

Looking at the stock market would not provide even the slightest bit of insight between pioneer and serato as it is not s publicly traded company as you stated. The only thing it would/could show is that pioneer is doing well but this is nothing new they have maintained 60% + of global market share of all dj gear combined. That being said serato is by no means hurting and is still growing to this day. This is a great move for them as well as Roland imo and as far as I am concerned pioneers rbdj succeeding is a good thing all around. I do see where you are coming from though and I am just hoping this all works out ;)

Interesting thoughts remy. I've had my serato colored googles on but I'm now starting to see trouble for serato. If pioneer keeps rolling, I don't think serato is dead, just potentially non industry standard software. Pioneer in the near future can literally force ppl on record box. The question is will Recordbox still be loved after the honeymoon phase. (Side note- I still wonder if Recordbox is a joint venture w serato, probably not cause it wouldn't make sense for serato, right?)

Rekordbox was never a joint venture with serato. Pioneer and serato were partners though on the hardware end.

That's obvious its not an official jv, but it's also obvious that rekordbox looks real similar to serato Dj. Maybe joint venture is the wrong wording, I was curious if serato helped rbdj, just a rumor nothing more.

Pioneer only owns 15% of Pioneer DJ. The rest is owned by private investment firm KKR so we really don't know how the finances are doing. Sales are great I am sure but it would be a bit short sighted to say that Serato is on it's deathbed. A majority of DJs are not willing to switch from what they are comfortable with. Heck there are tons of DJs content with rocking scratchlive and Sl-1 boxes. They will change when they are forced to but I would see a majority of them going to Serato DJ which is more familiar then a whole new product like Rekordbox.

Serato is not going anywhere period!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kill the noise with the deathbed talk.. It is best DJ software on the planet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's just a prediction like everything else in this thread. I love Serato and don't want to see it go trust me. But man Pioneer is gunning for its user base and if RBDJ wins out then Serato looses no matter what. Unless Seratos pockets are deep enough to compete which they aren't. The company is doing well but by no means are the able to compete they caught the DJ world by surprise with innovations since then everyone else has caught up.

SDJ still gets a side eye because it honestly isn't as stable for everyone will it change in time enough for it retain its user loyalty? We've been waiting for them no one wants to see Serato loose out in the end. Pioneer needs the competition to sell gear quarterly like they do.

I definitely agree but TBH I would've been gave RB a shot if it supported the DJM S9. I've had all kinds of issues with Serato HID mode.

Personally, I've yet to see someone using Rekordbox in the wild.

While Pioneer is certainly a financial mogul, I feel like comparing their stock worth is like comparing McDonalds to a local gourmet restaurant, or a mass produced bicycle company to a boutique hand-built downhill specific bike company. While most certainly one will be around for a long time, my heart is in the other.

Yeah I don't think it's out there enough for us to use it in a gig I feel like most DJ's would have to see a Jazzy Jeff Dj Premier or Just Blaze or another mayor DJ with a big name using it in the wild for us to take it seriously and give it a real shot.

For better or worse, there are plenty of other manufactures other than Pioneer to keep Serato Busy.

It is also possible that Serato themselves could become an acquisition target of InMusic, whom also own Denon, Numark, Marantz, M-Audio, MarQ, SoniVox, Alesis, AKAI, etc. And if that were to happen, InMusic may have deeper pockets and more EDM industry influence than Pioneer/KKR.

This acquisition would be cool, because InMusic also owns various Intelligent Lighting companies, Outboard Sound Processor Companies so there could be Intelligent DMX Lighting & Effects Board plug-ins easily added to Serato DJ on-top of the already existing Serato Video and ION/Air FX that InMusic already owns.

The more software is available the better for the consumer. More competition brings more choice, better product quality and cheaper prices!

Crazy talk. Serato is def hurting

I think Serato is preparing a crazy 2.0 update for Serato DJ

It's not about how many are "DJ-related" versus whatever. A company like Roland only has a limited amount of developer resources. To develop 31 new products concurrently is insane, let alone roll them out and dealing with the supply chain and customer service issues for it. Usually the quality of the product ends up taking a huge hit as a result. Not a fan.

it works with the s9

There are some users out there hurting. It is seemingly a deep down hurt that is blocking their perception of rality!! ;) In all seriousness though I find it funny for those who see PL, Pyro, etc as a reach and their "gasping for breath". LOL AT BEST!! Most DJ apps offer streaming and the majority use PL including Rekordbox & Serato. Traktor is pretty much the last SW to not offer streaming actually and FYI Traktor may get on board with PL as well (according to PL). This is by no means meant to replace a physical library but it is a great compliment IMO. Having the ability to put a playlist together while at work (9-5 job that pays the bills) or even traveling then being able to use said playlist in an instant with the major DJ apps is HUGE imo.

As far as Pyro is concerned I feel recognizing the importance of mobile presence is a good thing.


The rumors are these ventures take away from Serato's focus but for anyone who got involved with either of these you know you were dealing with an entirely different team. Dedicated developers and dedicated support.

Anyways point being is this new Venture can't hurt either IMO. If you are not impressed just don't buy into it. Simple as that right?

;)

BUT to be fair what harm could this do? As mentioned above if you are not impressed or have reservations you need not get involved with it. What harm can it do? As far as I am concerned it could only benefit users by offering more solutions in a familiar environment while paving the way for even more innovation. I know this "innovation" word is dangerous around here but as long as nobody is forced into anything what harm is it really causing?

BTW I know I am being super optimistic here.

You all make great points but it's up to the consumer to move the product and those entry to mid level brands are not what pro DJ/producers use.

With that being said I feel like if Serato wanted to be diverse they would have kept SSL and developed Itch into SDJ but they consolidation the business model maybe it was for the better at the time but now nothing makes Serato what it use to be to its core folks I mean it's all here on the forum.


They diluted the product I feel like to compete with NI and then Pioneer got mixed in on the software tip and the stakes increased now its new ball game for these guys. I'd rather they swim but if you see them team up with a company from Inmusic in the future if this venture fails I'd be worried as a fan of the product. Just biz talk its all speculation this is what happens when you drop teaser videos lol

True. VERY true.

What harm could it do? Lackluster product means poor products released to market, while results in slow sales. Overhead costs of R&D and inventory not being moved results in company running into financial difficulties and filing for Chapter 7.

This happens. All. The. Time.

Time will tell but I think you are looking to deep into this. This sounds like business as usual to me with a bit of a push due to new partnerships. I for one am excited for this and being admittedly both a fan of Serato as well as optimistic I can't see this being a risk at all for them. Keep in mind Serato sells SW and licenses they are not hardware developers. Furthermore I absolutely see no risk in it for the end users (DJ's etc.) who is what I was actually referring to in the quote posted. No real risk with much possible gain...................... just the way I see it at least.

We can revisit this in a year or so but I a gonna make an official hypothesis that this will not cause the demise of Serato, Roland or any of its users ;)

I wasn't talking about Serato, I was talking about Roland as a hardware development and manufacturer. Who knows. Maybe half of the stuff is just repackaging of what they already have and there's very few "actual" releases.

Yup, and thats the weakness thats gonna sink em

That 450 looks pretty sweet tho. Only gripes, no booth out and would of like a rec out and a built in usb hub

Controller + some sample player midi controller... Still need more details

Who would've thought - a controller. Looks like someone smashed an 808 with a DDJ-SX2.

Hahah anticlimax. I don't really see how this redefines anything.

Boooo. Its just a an All in one controller.... Boring.

The only thing "new" is that Serato now sends MIDI clock it seems.

(or at least, that controller does. maybe we'll see it in a software update for SDJ)

Man I'm cool with All in One controllers.......... But not "toy" sized one. Anything smaller than a DDJ SX is a toy and the SX is even kinda small. DDJSZ or bigger for live performance gear

serato 2.0 update?

1.9.3

Def not...........

Whos doing this in the club? People dont want to hear your beats, they want to hear their favorite songs.

I guess this is Serato's way of fighting back against Pioneer. I like everything but the green.

I feel like this was one of those things that engineers decided would be cool to combine and go together, but where no market research or user requirements gathering or feedback was done...

But geez now we know what Serato's software engineers have been working on for the longest time ever. Might explain why so many feature requests have gone untouched...

Im not going to say anything.

Aww cmon, your future hasnt been redefined? lolz

Kinda buried the lead there, didn't they? MIDI OUT

That 808 controller looks bad ass and unlike what anybody else is doing. I dont think i have the skills to do anything more than a few clap builds but who knows. Sick as bro

It all comes down to price. Every $100 it comes under 1k its going to be an attractive option.

win

Exactly a few will grabbed this and excel though. I can't front I won't drop the cash on it not really a product for me at least not now.

Why

tbh it looks pretty dope. for house and techno sets it would be dope. pop edm is too busy and pre programmed to do much with it other than mix

Agreed. While this isn't for everyone, aggressive pricing could rope in a few more DJs curious about crossing over to production.

I can see a market, but there's still plenty of gaps remaining to be filled on the SDJ front, as has been well documented on this forum.

tr drum sounds and sp8 samples xox sequenced? thats pretty dope

The comments on seratos page under this announcement are ruthless

Kinda share your sentiments. At the same time I'm keen to toss around some ideas and I'm sure it would be fun to try some stuff on it...certainly looks like a lot of fun which is pretty key to me.

I Wonder if my old circuit bent 707 could connect somehow

Guy from serato: "you ever seen a dj controller? Make it look like one of those"

Guy from roland: "but what about the drum machine?"

Guy from serato: "i dont know, just put it up top or something...we done here?"

Whens the last time they threw turntable users a bone?

Dicers? Next song on flip? The DS1 (toy with no power source)? Since SDJ came out has anything been added to improve usage on a turntable? Or has it all been performance pads and slide strips?

Ummmm its 1400 usd

Where's the pricing info? It wasn't released anywhere did I saw...

i'm with you on that.

Djcity mentioned it and the serato facebook page directly answered a guy who asked in the announcements comments. They then said to ask a dealer for final price so i dont know if thats msrp

I have to wonder how the serato guys take take the criticism from stuff like this. Like are they all up in the office the day before like guys this os gonna change the world...then they get slapped in face with all the negative backlash or is it just another day in the office.

Huh my sl3 doesn't have auto tune though

I think guys that play like this already play like this and have never heard any of the few i know moan about not having all in one system to make it easier.

I think they pride themselves in the fact that their set up is unique and personal.

I could be wrong though.

Anyways not one for me and 99.9% of the djs i know personally, looks okay though.

Good luck to Serato, i reckon this will introduce some new bugs to whatever Serato update they are bringing out to support it.

Happy days

Another product for home amusement, fine. But why the hell did they not mirror the layout of the buttons?

The que and play buttons on the left side are aligned to the right with the pads on the left and the right side have them on the right with the pads on the right?? Design error?

Anyway, good for who ever wanna rock the bedroom party with their own beats for 5 hours. Enjoy.

not sure why every post has to be negative. sure you are on the down slope of your career and you may think its silly, but damn people, have some vision for the future.

Be patient guys, 2 more products from Roland are coming ;-)

tfr.roland.com

DJ-99 and TT-99, for sure one mixer and one turntable, let's see what they'll bring more....

Turntable 😆
99 Mixer 😎

Let's wait and see then. Looks like there is gonna be something for everyone.

Everyone happy now?

not me as it will still be Aira so will still be a basically a VST plugin in a plastic box

Ok, sorry guys but you can go back to sleep ...

DJ-99: tfr.roland.com
TT-99: tfr.roland.com


What a JOKE seriously ! The whole industry is sick nowadays ???? Why is there such a gap between customers expectations/needs and market offering ????

Dj-808. Just got email from serato.

serato.com

ha ha all the hype for another dj controller

and not to mention that roland mixer looks shit, offers nothing for serato users and the TT is roland just trying to cash in on the resurge in vinyl sales

I like that I just hate that it's targeted at the controller market. Turntablist want future shit too lol platters will always be a turn off for me. I still have my Roland groove box that has all the 909, 808, and 707 with expandable memory so personally if midi out had been in Serato long ago syncing your tracks tempo to a drum machine now granted they've packed a lot of extras.

My other grip is being super creative doesn't translate to the masses unless spoon fed by media to accept it as the norm. It's 2016 people still only know about 10 songs at any given time and basically scoff at anything not already shoved down there throats so where am I going to use this beast of a machine besides at home?

I already produce and I have to blend my productions with very well known songs or else I'm loosing the crowd just based off the fact that it's unknown music. I think if we had a more creative society and less of a followers mentality embracing shit like this is "ground breaking"

Simple midi box
serato.com

Id argue it still wouldn't be groundbreaking as you can accomplish this with MUCH greater versatility using a machine and the bridge or maachine and traktor

The only thing I'm going to say is this is absolutely true. (maybe there is some little hidden feature but)

With SSL+The Bridge, you can do all that stuff AND MORE

A controller (that looks essentially like every other controller), an entry-level mixer (that is just a rebranded DJ Tech DIF-2S: djworx.com), and a cheap Hanpin turntable.

Revolutionary.

I must say I am disappointed as well in the release. The big "revolutionary" announcement proved to be nothing but anti-climactic. I'm all for the advancement of technology and all, but this was just a dud. I feel like they (Serato & Roland) could (and in the future, should) have use their energy to create something that dj's need and can use, rather than a gimmicky looking controller/toy.

seems like this is more of a Roland day that just happened to have one major serato impacted controller. kinda like serato just got on the Roland promo bus

This.

This will be great for producers who don't already have any of those drum machines already. Possibly a future collector's item depending on whether it flops or not.

Play a beat on the sequencer. Load notes into the SP8 and loop a few melodic bars using that Flip. drop in an acapella, add some scratches. Sounds like some fun to me.

I am curious...what exactly do people think that Serato should have released?

We already have plenty of...

Turntables
Mixers
Controllers

The other thing I don't understand is that there are a bunch of DJs ripping Serato for discontinuing Scratchlive for Serato DJ and bashing all the new features but if they don't do anything then another bunch of DJs that rush in bashing Serato for Sleeping and not keeping up with the competition. The funny thing is that when that group gets all the features they ask for they then complain Serato is copying Traktor.

Most definitely 👍

NXS2 HID mode?

Except that producers are still going to flock to drum machines. Why? Because it's a proper hardware unit for producing. I doubt anyone's going to use this new controller as a drum machine for producing - it's just too much.

I am betting this is more of a political issue rather than a technical issue.

So that's what my techs are missing, huge multi colored branding and model numbers plastered all over the surface.

Demo / try before you buy always the way to go

I called this one....... weeks ago. Serato is unimaginative. They take, they copy, they rename.

Longevity is not part of the business model. It could have been so much better, but no.... Steve West needs another $100,000 car for his garage.

Who is imaginative?

What did they take, copy and rename?

What is innovative?

What about this hasn't appeared as another product form?

Is it possible we could talk in circles? I think so.

Does this honestly "change the DJ game"?

Are you kidding? They litterally took a roland drum sequencer and slapped it on a generic dk controlller lol

This Serato x Roland announcement bores me. Anyone for a game of basketball?

How are you changing the game, redefining the future, or whatever they claimed by adding capabilities removed from the last version?

The Bridge is far more capable....

You could easily control an 808 or whatever type hardware from ableton.

You could literally duct tape a sequencer and a mic effect box on a controller and get the same function.

Maybe this is still in the works serato.com

my take on why its revolutionary

they are moving the idea of of dj and producer closer with obvious cues as to how to do it within a dj context.

if you had ableton and a controller, its still closer to production than djing.

if you have a controller with serato, you are a still closer to djing than production.

we all know that most young producers are shite djs. not that they cant mix 2 songs, but lets be honest, thats all they do. While products like this are not gonna produce instant jeff mills, if just one or 2 pop up to show what can be done with a product like this on youtube or facebook, then that will spawn countless others.

this product actually maybe a flop just like the 303/808/909 were. but all of those products eventually became not only a staple for production, but define genres. maybe, this leads to native instruments and pioneer to do more with a combo of digital djing interfaces rather than just djing or just production(not that native instruments hasnt been doing this for a while, their approach just wasnt for everyone).

realistically this is modular djing/production just like modular synthesis. the controller with drum machine are just the core, like having a mpc control other synths via midi.

at some level people will say, its been done before, which it has. but at this point how often do you see it? how many young people have the access to do it after paying for computers and dj kit? not many. so this is an option for both thats actually not that expensive. its encouraging experimentation for some kid that might just want to dj or not know much about hardware.

of course one rebuttle will be, no one wants to hear original music and/or most people are just playing 2 tracks. thats true. you will always have pop djs playing in a traditional djing way using 2 records to go back to back.

at the same time the paradigm is shifting just like it did for many people with serato. hell it took a lot of people 3-4-5 years to believe a computer wouldnt crash to use it in live situations or just didnt want to stare at a screen or be bothered with a computer. but kids now a days grow up looking at screens and are immersed in technology from day one. they look at technology different and get different outcomes from the same technology that older folks have.

again this is not the end all be all invention of all time, but it is opening up dj technology from an all in one concept. Some of the greatest house records of all time came from the all in one of a 808 and 303 hooked up to be acid house. had you told 30 yr old+ musicians that in 1984 they would have scoffed too. they were all afterthoughts and dismissed by folks just like, well 30-40+ yr old djs today.

I think it's going to raise the bar and be fun all at the same time...can't wait to play with it

And hopefully they make an add on version for turntable/cd use as well

I just watched the promo vid with mannie fresh. Ive got to say the controller looks more impressive in real life. It looks tiny in the pic but its massive next to fresh (then again fresh isn't a big guy).

I wanna get one just to throw 808 snare rolls over EVERYTHING. 80s night? Snare rolls over everything! Hiphop night? Double snare rolls on everything! Mobile wedding? Snare rolls over here comed the bride!

Thats what everyone said about the bridge too....

So just keep doing and making the same thing? Get out of that Alabama mentality bezz

^^ lol

Sorry, but there just isn't anything revolutionary about it.

If I glued an 808 to a controller - no one would call it revolutionary.

To be honest, I find it a bit big to be called "modular". In real life situations there is no space in booths to place a controller like this. Pretty often there is a mixer present and decks as well.

I'm all for modularity and with it more flexibility, but this form factor isn't exactly the way I would envision it..

If you dont like it use what you have been using and no problems right? Honestly what would be perfect like a pioneer sp1 but with 808 functionality. Ultimate sampler sequencer... I would also love an able to bridge update as well especially mixtape

...Ableton bridge update

Not if you have been asking for midi out for ten years....

Ummm thats literally what they did

Keep dreaming

You know what may have actually been cool. If it was just integrated into a good mixer. Id totally shell out $2500 for a S9 with a roland drum machine built in

Shit if this is the route we are going, can we get an ableton push built into the controller?






I think the industry is confused because DJs are producers, and producers are DJs right?

What they don't realize is that even though you may be both, you never do both jobs at the same time.

That sounds cool but I would rather have an add on midi controller with the Roland built so I can use with any mixer if my choice...the 62

Well at that point you can just buy a roland drum machine lol

Yup, that prob would have gotten a slightly better response, here at least.



Wow, that is perfectly stated.

theres really 2 ways to do more with djing, one is obviously turntablism an the other is a live PA performance(meaning using hardware to accompany dj sets).

combining the 2 is the point. live PA sets or remix sets of current and your own tunes. use the drum machine for long breakdowns or just kill the bass and throw in the beat you made.

Other than maybe DJ Enferno, have you seen anyone do this successfully? As a clubgoer would you like to listen to this for 6 hours?

To be fair you dont have to do it for 6 hours straight. This thing has its uses. For example i usually play the mike d remix of low life, its not really a remix,as much as it is a double time redrum. It would be nice to have the ability to turn any 70 bpm trap hop track into a funky breakbeat in the spot without having to remix in ableton before hand. Plus it saves space not having to have two files

im not saying currently everyone is doing it but we're talking now and not in 10 yrs. even if you were to really put time into a machine like this it might take 2-3 years to really get dialed in. might take 5-10 years of similar concepts to yield a workflow concept or technique that gains popularity with the masses.

i said earlier that there will be djs that play song to song in bars and clubs prob for eternity. that does work for most clubs and bars. But in every big city there are places where producers/djs produce live ( well we've had them for a long time, i think the concept had been done before but it was called 'laptop death match') and people play original stuff off whatever setup they bring.

plus the more electronic music(incl hip hop because its basically electronic minus a few hip hop bands) that is assimilated into youth culture, the more people are going to express themselves by djing and producing rather than grabbing a les paul or pearl drums. WHile you might grow up playing the trombone or cello, when you are at an age where you want to do more modern music(like many young musicians), you realize you have an option to keep the live vibe along with dj.

I dont think its a crazy idea to have dj/laptop producers having their own niche. People like to see the entertainment do something other than just stand around between records. of course, back in the dj booth days it was no big deal, but now so many dj booths are very visible or they just throw you on a stage. And we all know how awkward it is to have someone dj on stage that isnt doing anyting between songs.

You definitely not picturing what I mean...8 pads and syncing with the ports for syncing other products, tone play etc

You certainly won't be syncing the sequencer to your music with your glue bomb, or any of the other possibilities this unit has.

Exactly

this thread is exactly why people like craze or zabiela or hawtin rise to the top and stay there, because they have more to offer a crowd than other contemporaries and they welcome technology.

craze coulda just stuck to being a dope turntablist on vinyl and still to this day be as dope as anyone out, but he didnt and uses a combo of turntablism and live production(or what some people call pushing buttons) to push the envelope.

of course there is nothing wrong with playing straight vinyl to make people dance but i understand the intricacies of djing, sound, and set flow.

This


And that

Um, If I was using Serato ScratchLive, I sure would be.

Which is one thing that makes this so ridiculously not "revolutionary"

I don't mind this product general, I'm sure it will yield some good shit (for people without the mental glue). But its absurd to not be offering a MIDI breakout box.... smfh

is it that crazy to do a 15/30 minute set at say midnite and dj before and after? i think at this point a lot of kids are fairly accepting of experimentation within electronic music.

if you have you typical college or bottle service club of course they dont care. but they dont care about music or dj'ing either because they wouldnt be at that club if they did. they are trying to get drunk, laid and in the bottle service scene impress people.


people wanted a pro product and this seems to fit the bill more than a 250$ controller

For Roland, this means so much more than a single controller. Roland sells more than every Serato based or pioneer controller combined in Keyboards alone. I've been using analog Roland gear since forever 303, 808, 909, RE1 Space Echo, all were failures until they were re-purposed by hip hop/edm producers in the late 80's/90's.

Other than keyboards which, like guitars, are classically learned and rackmount processors, Roland has failed to be the market leader in every attempt in the EDM/DJ industry.

Their MC and SP series were dominated by AKAI MPC

Their DJ2000 DJ mixer was a blip compared to PioneerDJMs and Rane, even though it was the first to have MIDI out.

Pro Tools, VST's, Cakewalk, Logic, came along and changed the game yet again.

Roland is like the IBM PC of the music equipment industry, and they must realiziing what Microsoft's Bill Gates predicted and IBM learned in the PC industry the hard way . . . software will sell hardware, not the other way around. Pioneer has realized this and obviously became nervous with their fortunes being so reliant on Serato.

If the DJ808 gains traction, Roland will bid against InMusic to buy majority stake in Serato, outright, within a year . . . Book it! And Roland could dig enough coins from their ashtray to make it happen.

for sure seratos midi game has sucked forever and you are right that a midi breakout box is sorely needed.

at some level im sure roland wanted to make this profitable for them and keep a roland ecosystem as they are trying to sell gear.

But. Me personally I've been trying wanting to do this type stuff for years (since 2004) but just not finding the correct work flow (which can be highly personal and subjective DJ x Production)

...and this is ANOTHER device (and controller) with a designed/restricted work flow.

Locking the MIDI into going through this big ass controller is crap.

Imagine instead of an SL1 they dropped this piece of restricted kit back in the day. Some big ass device that only worked with some knock off turntables and crappy fader mixer all built together

and really the modular aspect of the aria stuff has pretty small footprints that you could easily set up on stands above the controller. also fairly inexpensive

I really don't understand people's issue other than being disappointed that they aren't the target market.

The 2 songs, eqs, faders, pitch slider crowd have what they want and have had it for the better part of the decade. You can use turntables and a mixer or CDJs and a mixer. There - that's all you need to do your thing.

It's obvious the direction of emerging DJ tech is blending the production and live performance side with DJing. Will most people care? Probably not, but these companies aren't trying to sell products to the punters in the crowd - they're selling products to the DJs and more importantly, they're selling the dream of fame to the guys that haven't "made it" with all these bells and whistles. The "if only I could do something more than just blending records, then I could make it" crowd.

The standard market is overcrowded and the club install and higher end controller market is trapped in pioneer's stranglehold. It sucks for people who don't like their gear (like myself), but that's where we're at.

If someone wants to try to compete with their mindshare, it's a huge risk - especially for someone new in the field.

The pro end is dominated by pioneer. Rane had the hip hop crowd but they're done - each attempt to compete with Pioneer on the club install turf (like the 68 and 64) failed. I thought they were gaining some traction with the MP2015, but it wasn't enough. Allen and Heath has the audiophile/nerdy mix dj niche, and Numark and pioneer are competing for the entry level. Native Instruments is doing their own thing with the producer/dj hybrid stuff and that's probably the closest competitor, but they threw their full backing to the STEMS format which hasn't really caught on.

Aside from a few outliers like Denon and Reloop, that's the landscape we have now unfortunately.

Roland tries to come to the market with some traditional setup after like 18 years out of the DJ market and no one will really pay attention other than the few anti-pioneer holdouts. You think any 4 channel club mixer offering will survive against the DJM 900? Any scratch mixer will last vs the S9 or even the large amount of 62s and 57 mkIIs that will likely be flooding the used market?

So we have this - a standard Serato controller with iconic Roland drum machine functionality built in. This thing will be useful for both the studio and the gig and nothing like it exists despite the somewhat bland packaging.

Most of y'all complaining are firmly in the 2 turntables and mixer crowd so why is this an issue? Keep your techs or grab some super OEMs and there's plenty of mixers to choose from - S9, used 62, 900nxs, whatever. Not only are those options available, but they're proven and isn't that what matters with the basic club/mobile crowd?

Maybe.

My theory is restricting shit, usually spells failure

You know how many producers there are out there with tons of midi gear they would love to easily sync to serato?

Serato would make such a good production tool if some simple things were tweaked... This is just backwords.

for sure. ive never understood why serato has negelected that area as much as they have. maybe they bank on people really into midi and outside production going to traktor back in the ssl days.

now with sdj, its just stupid. especially since midi has been around for 30+ years

Just not true

Reason still does well even though every plugin is stuck in a walled garden.

ProTools also does well despite requiring specific hardware to use.

Both of those softwares sync with each other and tons of other software

it seems like there would be some sort of work around to sync, what about the aria sequencer?

Sigh. All my comments assume there is even a midi out on it.

So the work around for syncing SDJ to whatever other midi hardware would ne to go thought that thing first. LMAO. So I would bring my turntables, my midi hardware AND the DJ-808?


That's the equivalent of the SL1 being an all in one crappy mixer two belt drives turntable device. That you could also plug some 1200s and mixer of choice into. Serato would have failed.

The reason Sersto won is that you could plug your already existing gear into the computer.

Same shit here. However many people make beats on Aria gear - MOST producers, especially with hardware have a unique set up.

Again, I dont mind this product existing. But it is at the cost of a simple device/sync that ALL producer/djs could make use of. This is only good for controllers who use the 808 or leaning that way. It does nothing for DVS DJs who produce with the vast array of other equipment/software out there. Nothing²

If it was a midi box, you could use it with ANY controller/dvs and ANY midi gear.

Great point the industry can't choose who to talk to. The producer the DJ the DJ producer the noob the mid level bedroom the nightclub only guy the mobile guy like who the hell are they really targeting

Truth.

Cats forget that Serato was born from Rane's solid hardware base....

That's gone...

One day y'all gonna click the link to this forum and *****Poof****

The SL boxes were amazing for their times, back in the day. Even the design is pretty slick af, mine still looks amazing and "current" for something that's 10+ years old.

While they may have something with the 808 controller, the TT and the mixer are not to be believed. Thought it's a troll but it isn't.

Well I think the Roland X Serato guys would go WOW! :)

Actually they helped each other. Rane was available for sale when Serato approached them to work together. From my understanding the price was pretty inexpensive. Rane made a lot of money from the partnership.

Which all may well be true....

But Rane stood ALONE for quite some time...

Serato? Hmmmm.....

Well, up until the last release of Scratch Live....

Can you guys imaging PAYING for a current version of Serato DJ?

Man listen....

I would pay for it in a second if I had to. I've had minimal issues since I've started using it and I like the feature set better.

Serato surpassed rane in terms of the industry mindshare years ago.

Rane gear was and still is a high water mark for quality hardware, but they priced themselves out of the market. If shit was going so well with rane, serato would never had made DJ to partner with other companies, and rane would never have sold to InMusic.

Rane and serato plateaued with the dvs crowd and the industry has moved on from that a while ago. Controllers took over the entry level market and pioneer cdjs took over the high end market.

Not saying I like it, but No way was serato was contingent on Rane surviving.

True. There must have been a reason why Serato has reached out to other companies to develop other hardware. Imagine if Serato sticked to Rane exclusively - there wouldn't be any controllers working with Serato. Serato would had been out of the business as well.

Serato reached out because they are money hungry asshats. Plain and simple, Serato wants your money and product be damned. It's all about nickle and diming now.

says the person nickle and diming off the remaining rane stock

"We thought it was important to get into the DJ world and to expand the AIRA brands.
We talked to Serato and decided to develop the first DJ controller."

Ken-Ichiro Nishi - Software Engineer for Roland

BTW this was not a written quote this was straight from the horses mouth via the release video. I doubt he is lying. What would be the gain?

Mybe not. But I would assume the contract notice would have to be given if either company planned to close shop... And maybe that's why Serato was freed. Or it could be the contract just ran out...

apparently there was a 10 year deal with rane when scratch live was released, that's why serato ditched scratch live after 10 years and brought out serato dj, and most likely in the licensing agreement no other hardware could be used other then rane , so we got itch, which was the same code so i bet rane had an issue with that and that's why they had to re write and badly at that a new program aka serato dj to house everything

lol sparky. I'm getting a return on my investment, little by little. Yes, I made a business decision. Thanks for the laugh ;)

The answer to that is pretty obvious. Pre SDJ how did serato make money? What did it sell? NOTHING! They didn't make hardware, they only made software and the software was free. So how did they make money? LICENSING! Now if you only make money when a piece of hardware sells why would you stick to only 1 hardware outlet? If the goal is infinite profit growth then you need to move more products so in this case they needed to open the doors to other companies.

Bezzle, try harder. Is that the only reason you can think of?

With all respect... As a former Rane employee saying something like this about one of the partners is not nice.

Scratch Live and the boxes, gave *both* companies the opportunity to grow and make money.

Understood, however, I would know more about the inner workings and history than yourself. No bravado but there are many facts that will never leave my lips. I'm being tame and venting slightly, the truth runs deep.

WE CAN HANDLE THE TRUTH! (or prob we cant and just argue about it for 6 months with johnny, sixx and bezzle talking about racism and sync)

all due respect as well. We've engaged many times over the years and you have been a huge asset in testing and such.

and I don't speak for Rane, there is no Rane, which also means I'm a little freer with my thoughts online ;)

But about this product....... blurred lines between DJ and producer, can't cater to every DJ style and desire.... all of this could be done already with midi and software... but yeah, that sums it up.

lol, you kill me. and those guys too.

its an all in one product and i think thats the key concept here. more for less and less need to connect 10 things to go on stage with multiple boxes and such. now just 3-4 boxes :P

There's one of my fans. lol


________________________________________
Bragging rights for life bitch! 😂😂😂😂😂😂
serato.com

nm

Usually all-in-one works when it replaces several items always already paired. Im sure there are several dudes super happy they can cut down on set up time, and a couple others who wanted to try these things anyway...

The anouncent made it sound like there was something EVERYONE will be interested in.

m.facebook.com

Looks like the Innofader ain't happy with the Mixer.

I don't really see the problem. It's essentially like having an OEM. Ai doesn't seem happy with anyone lately.

i know, dude needs to quit airing his legit biz out in the open. if you think someone sucks at djing fine, but your actual business bizness? dumb

Maybe he feels like he got kicked in the nuts after bitching over the Mixars thing?

im just not sure what hes gonna accomplish on facebook taking on an industry giant. guess hes got a good product, but it doesnt take much to blackball people in any industry

Lol! Rane won me as a fan via all the pms i received tellin me how much the guys over there loved my forum antics. The pms i received from serato were....not as kind.

How? Using some kind of external unit to get a clock off the SSL audio..?

Now, Innofader is dissatisfied about what Roland did to DJ Tech and speaks out, while there's no reaction from DJ Tech? Silly. Are they dissatisfied as much as Inno? And how exactly was Innofader affected? It's his logo there. Or Dj Tech? They got paid for the deal. The idea "Powered by DJ Tech" on a Roland product is out of mind, lol. Sounds like "Technics powered by Crosley". Or more precise "Pioneer powered by Hanpin".

Roland could have hired some ex Rane guys and design a sweet mixer from the scratch.

But I guess they wanted to come in at that "affordable" price point.

But did they miss the memo that Rane is no more and technically people won't be to eager to get the sound cards which this mixer requires.

I think they missed an opportunity to come in strong.

Im I bet Roland only heard of Ranes demise when we all did.

But man if they would have dropped a DVSxMIDI box right about now.............................

No, using The Bridge.

The 62 sends MIDI clock from SSL

With SDJ too right? But you need a second computer too right?

yes with SDJ too.

You do need a second computer but I wonder if you can feed the clock signal into hardware

You could use that soundbit Micro, but that's just another variable in the equation :/

Never seen that before. Thanks for mentioning it.

IMO they should have dropped something like this serato.com

Pretty cool given the build quality is as good or better than a DDJ-SX2. Paying 500 bucks more may be worth it for those who will actually use the extra features. My concern would be the system requirements needed to run stable. 2012 MBP may be too outdated.

Y'all acting like ScratchLive and Serato DJ are the same thing.

When Sam quit, that was the END of a certain level of innovation.

lmao.

Nailed it

With all this talk about innovation please tell me what's so innovated about Traktor or Rekordbox? They all have certain features that the others can't do and let's be real half the DJs don't even use those other features so all the "innovation" isn't even being used by most DJs half of these guys can't even mix.

I have seen guys who use Traktor do some amazing things. More along the line or production but hell look what we have here ^^ gotta roll with it I say. I may or may not end up using it but me using it or not has ZERO to do with how innovative any given feature is. FTR I don't know if anyone has claimed Rekordbox to be innovative. How could they be anymore innovative than Serato when they are basically following their every move!?!? LOL

I was speaking on the majority I know of course there is DJs out there actually taking advantages of the features that are given in any said software. My complaint comes from the mass of DJs complaining about innovation but don't even know how to take the features that are here (that they also complain there are too many of)....

Right now, Innovation = A Stable Product - I mean the type of faith you had in ScratchLive, knowing you just turn it on and it works....no questions, and you upgrade because you WANT to, not because of a bug.

Nowadays? THAT'S innovation when it comes to DJ software.

****Drops mic****

Spot the serato 7" vinyl Watchwww.youtube.com

Best add ever to the post!

pretty shocked they used an "aftermarket" CV especially one sold by a known bootlegger.

Not going to argue with that.

Maybe are teasing an official one coming soon.

lol damn

I thought it was interesting that they mentioned Pioneer in the video.

Yup.

A guy on another forum said this, and I tend to agree with him,

"What kills it for me is the fact that Roland only put four drum sounds on the damn thing!

Kick, snare, open and closed hi hat. That's yer lot.

IMO it would have been better to include percussion sounds - toms, bongos, cowbell, clave etc. so that they can be laid over the playing track (and DJs are going to be playing tracks with kick, snare and hats already there 99.99% of the time).

Roland.... if a job's worth doing, it's worth doing well. Just four sounds on a drum machine in 2016 is downright ridiculous.

I know other sounds can be played via the Serato sampler. I just think there should've been far more onboard sounds."

It's actually 4 drum sounds per kit (606, 707, 808 and 909) so 16 total.

the price too. 1400 is a good price point. surely they could have added extra sound card or a more spec'ed drum machine, but i think at 2k+ its too expensive.

i think its pretty packed for 13-1400

Its still only Kick, snare, open and closed hi hat per though, right??

there is only control for 4 on board sounds at one time.

I also have a hard time believing this is high quality when Roland's two other DJ products are rebadges of low spec OEMs.

The rest of the AIRA series is built well but you can seriously buy 3-4 of those units for the price of this.

still think a reggie watts type musician could benefit from this type setup. not thats its the end all be all setup, but i could see people doing things with this like that roland mc 303 groovebox.

it came out and was like a toy, very limited and then roland kept working with it to make newer,better products and the orig is a classic. of course the orig was much more expensive than the newer versions.

this ideas has long way to go, unless its abandoned by serato or roland or both. seratos def shown the ability to quit so theres that

'of course the orig was much less expensive than the newer versions.'

If you can't sample with it.... Reggie Watts type stuff, nay

without a laptop you get 4 sounds and a vocoder

right, so my comment about glueing a controller and drum machine together should have been - glue on half a drum machine.

without the TR toms, cowbell, handclap...

16 sounds and a vocoder according to the Serato page. Only 4 types of sounds though.

you only have control over 4 at a time though with the 4 faders. Furthermore, you only have control over shaping one of those sounds at a time as the 4 knobs for Trim, Tune, Attack and Decay are shared for the 4 sound slots

Personally I think being able to sequence the SP6 more than makes up for the lack of drum sounds; just load whatever sounds you want that might be missing in there.

If I hadn't already just bought a Denon MCX8000 I'd probably be getting this one...

Just give me a midi clock out and ill run Reason as a slave and eat this thing up!!

Come on Serato quit with the games already and just give us a midi clock out already..........smh 😒

It can also sequence SDJ's Sampler banks

^^And doesn't this unit have a Midi out for you to connect to Reason or whatever?

LOL - IF that would work it would be ridiculous if all you wanted to do sync Reason (as I have been requesting for the last decade)

Well the site says "Connect external instruments via MIDI "

I don't see why you couldn't run it to whatever the hell you wanted. Maybe these guys make a midi box to act as a hub. www.midisolutions.com

you can record within the serato and add it as a track or sample? seems pretty easy, maybe not as flexible as his set up, but it wouldnt be hard to record your voice and use it in the mix.

So it might not be midi clock out but 1.9.3 added ableton link i lost my mind. For those that dont know it very simply links all iOS apps, ableton and pretty much any other app that has it as a feature and it works great. SDJ to SDJ or SDJ to ableton albiet without the bridge, but this will be a very nice feature.

Fun fact is that even though Link is an Ableton product, you don't need to own Ableton to use it, e.g as you said, Link up Serato DJ with Serato DJ across different computers. There are many many possibilities. Serato DJ and Ableton Live linked across different computers, same computer, linked to iOS drum machine apps etc.

Yesssssssssssss. Best feature add in a LONG time. Definitely going to test the shit out of this. I guess Serato has been working on their MIDI code a lot recently.

Thank You.

nah, that wont work for 'live looping'

maybe there will be a way (according to my work flow) to do this now... Link :)

I was going to point out how ridiculous it would be to use a DJ-808(especially if you dont really want to use it) + another piece of hardware and cable just to connect two piece of software.

but now I dont have to.... Link :)

Last night I was pondering how the DJ808 with Serato and the Aira MX-1 with Live would be a pretty nice combo for a live PA jam/gig/whatever...Link didn't even cross my mind! This is a nice step in the right direction - now let's see what other MIDI related treats come our way from Serato (fingers crossed)

Adding Link to SDJ also negates a big selling point of the DJ808, as there are several drum machines for iOS that destroy the TR-S (on paper, at least). An iPad running Audiobus or Kymatica AUM provides a pretty serious "groovebox" and/or FX processing setup for short money (not counting the iPad itself 😉)

True in most aspects.

No one who simply wanted to Link software or other hardware was going to buy that. It's good for people who are looking at a new controller and want to try, or do 808 type production.

Link sounds pretty bad ass. Obvious concerns over computer processing speeds and network traffic on open devices but hey, if it is stable in professional environments, thats pretty cool.

now akiem can shut up about midi?

Heck yeah, Reason just dropped an update supporting LINK as well so really no need to buy this unit anymore.

LINK looks super dope, now you can just run your favorite DAW and controller with Serato!

Hmmmmmm..... Maybe.

(I got plenty more to say the, plenty)

So like I was saying for those who said I wasn't right about the business part of Serato. I was pretty spot on in regards to them needing financial partners to fight the DJ war so to speak. Read here.....this is kinda scary to me.

djworx.com

"However, two minority shareholders, who are the parents of the founders Steve West and AJ Bertenshaw, are now at retirement age. So having helped fund Serato in its early days, they are now looking at options around their possible exit.”

Normal business as usual.

Understanding it a bit more may ease some of the fear.

"Young Ly, Serato CEO said: “ The business has never been better. It is the most used professional DJ software product globally, continues to lead the industry, and we have many exciting announcements still to come."

Words of defeat indeed!!

That being said I would personally prefer to not see this happen but as mentioned above this is nothing out of the ordinary nor was it unexpected. Point being nobody is in need of anything here. There are wants to be satisfied for some deserving financial backers.

Nah the words coming out their mouth don't matter but numbers actually do. Trust they are not making the loot they need it's not business as usual this is the mark of business that foresees financial woes. 40% is not a small number if they were going public on the stock market and offering 40% of the company then that be different but they are staying private and offering 40% under their terms of course and you expect me to believe that's business as usual for Serato when the last 10 years they didn't need investors because it WAS all good. Unless things turn around soon and quickly it may not be so good for our beloved Serato you think I like what's happening? Nah not at all.

I'll still be using Serato for the foreseeable future but business don't expand by loosing investors and staying private and offering a small percentage of itself to its customers. Not that business haven't done it before but you have to not just look at what people are saying and actually go and study market and look at finance statements since Serato is private it's all secret. However Pioneer and Roland's numbers are public and Rane going tits up right around this time just doesn't sit well. Anyways I guess we all just have to wait and see.

Actually if its the most used product globally then they have a problem as, for the most part, they make their money on the initial sale.

Except that PioneerDJ is a private company, and Roland's stock has cut in half the past year.

Someones isn't getting licensing fees from Rane right now.......... and trust, they made a lot.... really, the number is stupid.

Mom and dad said we aint fittin the bill no more for your lil fancy software company. Go find some money to replace us, we out!!

But in turn Rane wasn't selling as many mixers when the exclusivity was over.

First question...if you were a silent partner that owned 40% of a company that was doing so well why would you sell?

Second question...if you were a company that was doing so well why would you have to publically announce that you are looking for an investor(s)? If you were making that much money wouldn't there be investors circling like vultures to own a piece of the company?

Im also looking at it like this...thats another 40% of the company that may no longer be in line with the view that made the company great to begin with. It used to be by djs for djs. Then sam left and it turned into well lets follow everyone else and cash in. Odds are the investors that link in wont really give a shit about improving the dj culture. It will be just that more of a push to the "make toys for bedroom kids = return on investment" types

My thoughts exactly.

been saying they're gonna go under or sell. its obvious when they started monetizing. in order to sell, you have to be making money. they most likely still arent making much profit if any

Hi Rebelguy, I'm AJ, one of the founders of Serato. The answer to your first question is that this "silent partner" is actually two people: my father and Steve's mother. They've been with us since day one, and they own 20% each of Serato, which is and always has been a family owned business. Both our parents helped us out at the start and are currently around the 70-years of age mark. They just want to know what their options are for retirement and enjoying their golden years. This is a personal choice of theirs and both Steve and I think that's pretty fair given how much they helped us in the beginning.

The answer to your second question is actually pretty straight forward. We DIDN'T announce it publicly. Our financial advisors sent a private information flyer to a few selected interested parties and someone leaked the information to Mark Settle at DJworx who wrote an article about it. He gave us a few hours notice out of courtesy and we realised that we would have to make a public statement about it if it was going to be all over the blogs.

If you must know, we have no shortage of interested parties, and I have personally received requests from potential investors every month for many years. The reason we made the public statement is because we thought people might start making wild speculations but the fact of the matter is, we will have plenty of investors to choose from, and our parents have no need to sell any shares whatsoever if we don't like the deal.

Burn.

why don't the remaining 60% of the shareholders buy them out if the company is so profitable?

Hi AJ,

Thank you for your response. I was well aware of who the investors were as I read the article on DJ Worx. My question was that if you were a silent partner in a company that was generating a positive cash flow why sell. I have a retirement fund and have invested in many companies. I also plan on remaining a partial owner in my own company when I retire. Why sell if the companies are providing income. I guess I could hypothesize that one could sell and take the money and get one lump buyout sum...similar to Rane I suppose.

In response to my second statement, I was not aware of the leak. Thank you for clarifying that.

Great idea.

popcorn.gif

I still wonder if Rane decided to compromise a bit and released a controller, if they would still be around. Say something in the some price range as an SX2 or something...

Boom...........

I did actually answer that part of your question, but it was quite a small, simple answer and you might have missed it. When I said "This is a personal choice of theirs" I was letting you know that they have their own personal reasons why getting the full value of their shares now is preferable to a long term investment, but that those reasons are deeply personal to them, and I'm not going to share them with strangers here.


The question doesn't make sense. Let's say the ratio of profitability to company value is around 15x (a typical value for a tech company), that means in order for an ordinary person like me who started with nothing to be able to afford to buy out someone with a similar shareholding, I would have had to save every penny of profit for 15 years assuming the company didn't grow at all. In real life the company has grown every single year since we founded it, so even if I saved every penny of profit I ever got since day one, I still couldn't afford to buy them out. I own a decent chunk of a valuable company, but I don't have rooms full of cash that I go swimming in like Scrooge McDuck.

Welp...

That's all folks....

Did you think about buying Rane at all?

Or your current model of licensing is more profitable since you don't have to deal with repairs, warranty etc

Could have been nice for you to have your own hardware division, but not Native Instruments style, more like google style. Release a Nexus Hardware and still allow other Hardware manufacturers to license and even customise as they like. Eg the way MCX8000 got the tone pitch play before everyone else.

Thanks for taking the time to provide some insight on this AJ - I hope you guys find an investor that will allow Serato to move forward in a very competitive industry while staying true to the vision that gave your parents the confidence to "join the party" at the outset.

So how about that 808 guise.

Mo Money Mo Problems.. I'm sure if AJ and co had the capital they would buy em out in a second, but lawyers and promissory notes have to be evaluated at current market value.. and we all know Serato worth some major doe..

This thread delivered....

quality content

Finally.

Even though this issue is pretty much dead I kinda take back everything I said about Serato being in danger I didnt think about all the thousands if not millions on non-American customers that heavily rely on the software who dont seem to be jumping ship the other language forums are pretty lit.