I feel the same way I hope this is a priority on the next release....It is annoying.

Hi Melvin (and Maskrider)

Can I ask you guys which pitch range you are using? You can check this in the bottom right hand corner of the virtual deck area (see screen shot).

As you can see in the screen shot, I have mine set to +/- 8 (which is the same as on a Technics 1200). You can adjust the pitch range on the VCI-380 by hitting the 'RANGE' button below the pitch fader.

Let me know how you get on.

Cheers

Hi,

I am also on +/8%. I think having an option of 4 or/and 6 might resolve the issue somewhat. I genuinely think its the resolution of the short throw pitch control that's the issue here. It's all well and good making gear that's 'convenient' in terms of portability but if it doesn't do what it should then there goes the convenience argument out the window. I am absolutely furious about this. After doing some research I can see I'm not the only one who thinks this is a serious issue and have not seene one decent response from the companies involved in the production of this device or software.

If indeed this is a design flaw thats not repairable with a software update (which imunderstand Serato are very slow on) then I guess I'm stuck trying to flog it off on eBay and a return, purely on principle, to Traktor!

Hi Melvin

Yes, having a +/-4 or 6 option may help in this situation as what you are experiencing is a hardware feel phenomenon due to the difference in size between the pitch fader on the VCI-380 and that on the Technics 1200.

The fader on the 380 is roughly 2/3 the length of the fader on a 1200, which thus translates into greater sensitivity on the 380 as the same physical movement on both would translate to different pitch movements.

There could also be other hardware related inputs to this difference in feeling - magnets and resistance for example. I can assure you that all of the available movements (steps) on the 1200 are available on the VCI-380, there is just a difference in physical movement required to get them.

These sorts of issues are common for newer users of controllers (or other devices) that have different hardware specifications to what they are used to, but I'm sure you will become accustomed to the difference before long.

Cheers

Dear Aaron,

Thanks for commenting. You have however just described my problem exactly without offering any sort of solution other than stating 'I will become accustomed to the difference before long'

Are you serious? Is this Serato Customer Service at its best? Telling me exactly what I've previously described and then tell me to become accustomed to it? That's pretty shoddy customer care/service if you honestly believe that's a comprehensive answer to my complaint.

Just to be completely clear, its completely impossible to manually mix on this device without either

A) constantly adjusting the pitch as you CANT adjust the BPM's in increments of 1/100

B) Press the sync button (obviously this means I'm not doing it manually)

Could you at the very least let me know if you guys are considering offering a wider set of options for the pitch range in a future update? I don't think this is an unreasonable question/request?

I look forward to a more complete answer in terms of a possible solution rather than a description of my issue if that's OK?

I'm sorry if I am coming across as a little frustrated that's not my intention, I'm just looking for a simple answer to a simple question.

Hi Melvin

As a starting point for deciding what pitch ranges are available for each controller, we take the lead from the manufacturer. So, for example, Vestax will come to us and say "we want the VCI-380 base pitch range to be +/- 8 because that is Vestax standard". We then build that as the base range for the VCI-380.

As I mentioned earlier, this base range is the same as that for the Technics 1200 and the reason for greater sensitivity is the reduced physical size of the fader on the VCI-380 due to limited space on a portable controller.

In answer to your question:

This is something that we are often discussing and eventually limitless pitch ranges will become available, but the addition of this feature is not currently planned. What this means is that yes, whatever range you want will eventually be available, but no, it is not currently scheduled to be built.

In terms of current solutions...

In my opinion, the VCI-380 has one of the smoothest and best responding pitch faders in the controller market, the only problem with it is that it's small. The Numark NS6 and NS7 are also good and quite a lot bigger, so would help. The Pioneer DDJ-S1 and DDJ-SX also have large pitch faders, but, in my opinion, don't have as smooth an action. You could look at trading in for one of these.

With your Technics 1200s, you could use our Scratch Live software (with a Rane interface) to get that feel you want.

I realise none of these options (or answers) are ideal for you in your situation, but I'm afraid this is how it stands at this time. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Cheers

I understand Melvin's problem here. I also find the pitch slider to be frustrating on the 380. It's not just the small-form fader, there's something odd when mixing around 0 on the pitch slider.

(I generally mix in +/-8 mode, so all my comments apply to that.)

I have to move the slider quite a bit to get to +0.06, and there is no +0.03. However after getting to +0.06, movements go smoothly in increments of 0.03 (0.06, 0.09, 0.12, etc). Moving back from 0, there *is* a -0.03, but it feels too far away from 0, and too close to 0.06.

Another problem: while mixing I will get the + or - value I want, only to look up again while mixing and find that it's changed to another value. I can even get the pitch slider to a value, watch it for a minute (no change), then in the middle of my mix I look up and it's changed. I might understand it if I was only talking about situations where I had tons of bass vibrating the controller, but it happens even when mixing in headphones at home with zero vibration.

Also, let's not forget the bizarre glitch where the increments coming from -8 go: -8.00, -7.97, -7.94, then... +3.88. This is a confirmed issue noted in serato.com

I really hope this is something Vestax can solve with a firmware update, or that Serato can solve when the 380 gets the Serato DJ upgrade.

Not only that but this 380 as a large dead pitch area around 0% pitch (just like a 1210) but is worse on the 380! I dont get why on earth there is a dead spot on the pitch?

I agree 6% on this tiny pitch fader would be sooooo much better and more reliable!

We can only hope and wish this happens in serato dj.

pitching on the VCI-300 was easier due to the +/- 6% pitch but it's not impossible. I have no problem mixing on those pitch controls so it's not "impossible" as you state. Sometimes you just have to adjust a bit with the jog wheel, but that's no different from using turntables.

I agree that it's not impossible, I still don't use sync on it. I do find myself spending time compensating for this odd pitch slider while mixing. Especially the odd changing of +/- % value in the middle of a mix.

I'd love to know what happened to +0.03...doesn't exist on my unit as I mentioned before, while -0.03 does exist.

Hi Arron,

I appreciate you answering my post. I imagine its not you that makes the decisions in terms of what gets bumped up the priority lists for the devs so this is in no way a jab at you personally.

OK, it's not 'impossible' to scratch manually, you can, with constant adjustments...hell thats what i used to do years ago with my belt driven decks.. This isnt quite as bad as those were, nor as expensive but to be frank, it's too annoying to use it over a long period. It's like dealing with a high maintenance partner, it's quite possible but more taxing than one would hope for.

I have traktor scratch pro for my technics so I have no need for scratch live. To be honest, in terms of its reliability and customer service as in reacting to their customers complaints and frustrations versus my experience with NI, Scratch live is not really something I would consider looking at.

In short, using traktor with technics I can easily adjust the bpms in 1/100th increments no problem (round the centre area is a no go but I just avoid that area). Lets be honest, that's the minimum that should be expected to ensure a genuine professional mixing experience. At £600 I believe this should be a given. As it stands, I feel robbed, disappointed and have a really bad taste in my mouth.

This is your guys business, is it not important that your customers, eg your lifeblood, have a great experience? Why do you think 5 star hotels have five stars? Until I bought this unit I honestly expected a five star experience. How wrong I was. Maybe I'm being over dramatic and my expectations were too high and maybe I should have done more research, but either way, not too happy and I certainly wouldn't be recommending anything with a Serato badge attached to it anytime soon.

Thanks for your feedback anyway, I can't argue I don't know where I stand now, that's for sure. Eg - If I understand you correctly?.... You will look to be resolving this at some point but it's not even on a list to be actioned at present - that's very reassuring!

Best Regards,

Melvin

Correction to above:
... "OK, it's not 'impossible' to scratch manually, " should have been
...."OK, it's not 'impossible' to mix manually"
Apologies.

Interesting topic here. I use a vci-300 which is rumored to have 6%, although I hear 8% on the 380. Same length on the physical fader lengths between the two. I mix EDM mostly, so I do some pitching and some transitions I like to layer in early and ride out. I have honestly not had an issue like you describe getting that done and I don't sync. I usually set the pitch as fine as possible, hand drop it in and then ride the jog sides if I feel things are headed downhill at any given time. Coming from turntables I would think you're no stranger to the nudge & scrub on the wheels to do a little bending. Might I ask, just out of personal curiosity what you're doing that is creating a demand for pitch perfect resolution? Thanks.

Hi, coming from 1200s and traktor...guess that spoilt me for more accuracy pitch wise. As you insinuate, this is a different beast....there is accuracy in here just not as reactive pitch -wise as I would have hoped. It's midi based so wow and flutter shouldn't come into it, which it doesn't. There's a new issue...pitch control. It's not a deal breaker but its so close to perfection, its a bit of a crime. I've used other controllers and this bar the pitch is way ahead. The problem here is the lack of will to do anything about in a given time frame if at all!!

Well, you'll find a hard time getting the same jog resolution out of other software as I understand it they wrote a special driver for the 300's jogs, and I do believe they used the same resolution encoders on the 380. So if you change up software you might be robbing peter to pay paul, if you get my drift. It's not that the team doesn't take requests to heart, it's just the marching orders come from the vendors first and foremost so the feature might be better addressed to Vestax to prioritize a better resolution offering. Serato in theory could do it, but that kind of violates the agreement of spec with the vendor (Vestax) as they tailor things to their specs. So there is a bit of politics at play here you see. Best of luck adjusting, I think you'll do fine.

Yes, the jog resolution cat be faulted, maybe the red location light could do with tightening up a bit but its not going to effect performance, just feels a little half finished. I understand the dynamic of the software/hardware business mechanics in terms of how these units come to market but to be honest that's their problem and shouldn't reflect in the end user experience in terms of their reactiveness to a customer complaint. Rest assured, if I took this issue directly to Vestax my bet would be the onus would fall on Serato. However, to be fair that's only an assumption based on what I've read, I've not raised the issue with them directly myself. My own conclusion is that this technology is relatively new and most of the companies concerned have been releasing half baked products for us consumers to act as lab rats/beta testers. I'm sure in time these gripes will be addressed. As I mentioned earlier in a stronger tone, this still leaves a rather bad taste in my mouth based on the price I paid for the unit and bearing in mind the relatively good reputation for both the companies involved this issue was an unpleasant surprise. I do like the idea of the NI traktor controllers where both hardware and software is made by the same company but i have had a little play on them and felt the layout and construction was far inferior to the vci380. The PIONEER ddj ssx is too big so heres hoping something will come to market that ticks all the boxes for my requirements in the near future. Anyways, when I sell this device, I'll be testing others more thoroughly before parting with my cash. On a positive note, I can view this unit as a benchmark for what it is I expect them to be able to do as maybe I was wrong to assume everything would work as I expected. Maybe my expectations were set too high (I don't think this is the case but hey hoe, you live and learn)
Peace.....