Let your skills shut them up.

Center your arguments around stability being more important than bells & whistles...

And you really think that ramming a list of subjective reasons down someone's throats about why YOU feel Scratch Live is better is going to make a single bit of difference?

Why one or the other? Both are professional level packages with their own strengths and weaknesses. Let people decide for themselves.

Just out of interest, have you used Traktor Scratch Pro?

Yeah, just say "to each his own, I prefer serato." Who gives a shit what they spin with?

oh dear! People are getting a bit wound up.
I did start this thread with the intention of it having a bit of humour and the Traktor vs Serato argument has been on going between djs for years.
Everytime I talk to any other djs who support traktor its just a bit of good banter so
whatever the reasons for each I'm just interested in the argument for Serato as I use , simple as that!

i wonder what the true market share for all dvs is broken down by segment. that would be interesting. mods?

mobile
club
other

broken down further by region.

I can think of only two things when it comes to DVS.

You get what you pay for.

Can I get good product support for my investment.

All you need to say is "Serato works great for what I do. If you like [insert the inferior DVS brand of your choice here] better for what you do, that's great. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to get back to mixing."

If you need a list of reasons why Serato is better than Traktor to shut up "clueless DJ's" kinda makes you seem like the clueless one. I'm with Skratchworx on this one. Have you used Traktor?

Honestly, they're both really really good systems. Traktor started off on the rocky side of the business, but then again, they were the first ones out. The finally ironed out most of the problems.

Yes, we Video SL with Serato but Traktor users can argue that they have 4 decks, multiple professional level sound effects, Xone 92 filters built in, and a few other things that we don't have. Traktor is geared more towards the EDM DJ's, while Serato is more towards the hip hop/mainstream DJ's.

If you really want to give them a list, why not try both than come up with your own list. Honestly, as much as I love Serato, I been thinking about switching to Traktor. I been seeing a lot more Traktor setups lately too. IMO, it's whatever works best for you. At this moment Serato is working for me because of videos, but Traktor is a close second.

BTW, Serato ITCH does have AUTO SYNC! lol

:)

Hi guys,

since I am posting on a serato forum, I would like you guys to know I currently dont own serato, but I plan on buying it when I have the money. SO i cant fully speak on the serato side

But I do own final scratch 2(hardware), which uses traktor 3 as the software which is simliar but not quite the same as traktor scratch pro.

I have seen both in action and I would like to comment, not to offend serato users:

Your arguement was traktor has the "sync" button which is noob. it is
But with serato, ive seen even bigger noobs that dont know how to beat match because they solely rely on the the big visual wave forms that run vertically.

I only started out with traktor because I couldnt afford serato at the time. So I had to learn to beat match without looking at the wave form or BPM because traktor 3 was that ghetto. Granted there was a "auto-sync" button in the program, but honestly it sucked dick because the sync wasnt perfect and who would call themselves a DJ if all you had to do was press a button? I learned to beat match and use traktor without it all together - but yes, the button is there and existent.

Similarly with serato, I am disappointed that many serato users I have seen can't beatmatch without a screen if their life depended on it. I would seriously like to see them DJ with traditional vinyl: no computer, no bpm indicators, no wave form, just pure skill.

So yeah I guess another big reason why traktor hates serato users mainly is because traktor offers 4 channels. If you guys ever want to step up your game, 4 channels is it. Listen to J espinosa, wild 949 - bay area dj, he sometimes uses 4 channels ( 2 most of the time with serato for his day to day 5 oclock traffic jam sessions). And yes, 4 channels does make that huge difference in where u can bring in acapellas over different instrumentals while bringing in a 2nd track. and also edm too


when i made these comments, I KNOW the industry standard is serato because of its stability. I KNOW not everyone that uses serato arent horrible DJs who dont know how to beatmatch without a screen.
But please, realize the same applies for traktor before you make ignorant comments. just because you met one dude who pushes the sync button doesnt mean everyone does it

But all in all heres the point:
noobs use traktor
noobs use serato
pros use traktor
pros use serato

both are good systems, pick and stick with what you like

side note:
if serato ever supports 4 channels, im going to jizz in my pants. that is all

Fuck a whole list.... You only need one reason!
Serato just works each time every time!! I'll take stability over lame efx and four decks anyday.

nice post but you made 1 mistake and that's that in sl we have 8 mixable channels now and 8 > 4.

Besides that this is the bottom line this is computer software for djing not catholiscm or Christianity so there's no reason to go out upon the mountiantops spreading the gospel of scratchlive to the non believers. Unless you work in guitar center or get paida commission from serato then there's no reason to need or give a list on why any software better, no software out there is perfect so it's up to the user to look into the facts play with them all and make a choice of what works best for them for their own needs. Then if you make that educated choice you'll know enough to answer you you prefer your software over others.

judge not by the cover of the book, but by the content. Translation: IT'S ABOUT THE */$%?&* DJ,that's one two; please people grow up! now we have to become product partisans just because you own something that others don't? (this goes for both)

my favorite reason for anything - because.

I'll avoid giving my reasons, you guys are smart enough to give him many ;)

p.s. third deck coming in the not completely distant future but for now you can use the sample player and midi map the pitch control for each player. So really, you have 8 decks right now, if you know how to use it.

3rd deck huh?? So I'm assumming you guys finally solved the space invaders liscensing issues??

Farmer's voice :)

WOOHOO on the 3rd deck hint!!!!

Why are you effin' teasing me with the EMPATHSL?! LOL

Azn, I'm a bit confused....why are you saving up $$ to buy an inferior program? Ok ok, you didn't say inferior but you implied it when you said "If you guys ever want to step up your game" comment. Secondly, you said you don't use the sync button but then stated that it "wasn't perfect"? How would you know if you don't use it? Oh I see, you played with it once? Well that just leads me to assume that if it did work, you might be using it?

Just really don't like passive aggressive comments like "we" only have 2 channels (which we don't see above) or "we" watch the waveforms, or serato has "bigger noobs" that watch those waves.

If you came out and said "i disagree because X, Y, Z" I would have respected your comments as legit criticism but, when you come in saying your saving up to buy an weak a&&, 2 channel, wavie program, sounds a bit judgmental for someone who has never used the program.

BTW, been DJing since late 80s, and know how to beat match with and without the waves.

serato & rane are behind the product, that should be the only reason you need to give anyone.

Actually, I just thought , the answer is obvious..

TTM 57SL

Thank you very much , good night...

TTM 57SL is an amazing mixer no doubt
ive used it before, but the down fall is obvious

- the internal hardware is only SL1 equivalent, which is 12bit audio
audio 8, the hardware interface for the new traktor scratch pros, are 24bit audio interfaces, the equiv to the SL3 hardware.

- also, its only a 2 channel mixer =(
sorry, but im a big fan of the pioneer DJM series

I see potential once rane makes a new TTM that has SL3 equiv hardware built in the mixer.
However, i dont see them realistically making a 4 channel mixer because the majority of serato users once again, that uses TTM 57SL are turntableists or hip hop djs who most of the time only use 2 channels.

so yeah
nice try, TTM57SL may have one you a battle
but this whole traktor vs serato thing is a WAR lol
jk, i like and support people who use both
im just trying to put my most non-bias opinion out here

I dont know, big chad up there just dropped the 3rd deck bomb, logically speaking (with wishful thinking) it would make sense to make a mixer that would be compatible with the upcoming 3rd deck, and since they improved the hardware on the SL3 soundcard I dout they would want their big time pro mixer lagging behind the audio dongle.....new mixer could be in the tube

seen several ads pushing TTM57s lately, so you never know? Chad?

ya chad hook up with the PMs (no blood) I promise to keep the secret just give some hints cause im in the market for a mixer and id be pissed to finally take the plunge and the new hottness come out

oh my bad about missing your post earlier, kinda just skimmed , but anyways im here to answer any ambiguities

When I wrote the post, I knew I would get criticism for it - its okay I understand; this is like saying "Hilary for President" in the deep south.

To be blunt: in some ways, I did imply serato was inferior to traktor. Otherwise why would I have made the post if serato was perfect?

To give you an examples of where traktor was beating serato if you didnt pick it up the first time around:

-Before SL3, traktor had the 24bit audio interface. Audio 8 was not only the same price as SL1 but developed by Native Instruments a year+ before SL3 came out to shelves this year.

-Traktor was the first to have 4 DECKS - serato supports 2 decks.
But now I see and im very glad serato is catching by adding a 3rd deck.

-Traktor has effects and fx like xone 92 filters, reverbs, flangers, and etc that serato doesnt.

Trakor had this main problem though: stability
The stability used to be crap, like I couldnt record a 10 min mix with final scratch 2 because one point or another the signal skips. But that was then(2005 era), traktor has ALSO upped its game with stability.

Those are facts - flame me all you want, but facts are facts

Thats it for the facts, now let me express MY opinion:
Competition is good for the consumer my friend. See without traktor for competition, maybe chad at serato may have not thought about adding a 3rd deck? just a thought

Also, stability is more important for me therefore that is why I am willing to pick serato over traktor, but I WISH to see serato step up its game so that it can fill in the gaps between trakor vs serato. Because if serato sleeps, traktor will slowly take some of serato's customer base.

And finally, I will address the whole "sync button" issue and the vertical wave form

When I initially got traktor, I was skeptical and I tried out every function the program could offer, wouldn't you? What I mean is that the sync button "doesnt work" is that even though the BPMs on screen and the approximate beats are matched, its not perfect. The bass will go "th-thump". So even after pressing the "sync" button, you would STILL have to manually tweak the pitch a little for a clean mix. And if the button did work perfectly, I, personally, wouldn't use it. Would some people? probably. Like I said, Im very prideful when it comes to claiming that I can really mix without looking at a screen or using any button that does the work for me.

I imagine your just like me Mexikanman: someone who takes pride in their mixing. So I assure you that it pisses me off just as much when I see someone just using the sync button just as you see people who can't beatmatch but use the vertical wave forms.

sorry about the long post

aznchopstix does makes some valid points...however, Serato rules!

Do we really have to go on how many decks?


It's obvoius we have alot of Decks here.:)

lol once again i will point out your incorrect "facts" we have 8 mixable tracks in SL

channels is different from decks
can you hook up 8 turntables or cdjs to serato?
didnt think so

if you want to put it that way traktor also has 4 extra channels that are MIDI compatible
on top of the 4 decks that it supports. so in total 8 again

except traktor can support up to 4 DECKS, as in CDJs or turntables

Staring at the screen is about one one millionth as wavielicious as using automix.

On the 57SL argument I really dont see the point in 24bit audio, would anyone really notice the difference?
Most source material for music is usually from mp3s which would be compressed 320k at best, then most sound system setups are all analogue or have analogue somewhere in the chain and finally I would challange anyone to walk into a club and know if the sound is 8bit or 24bit...

^^^ What about when you're recording etc??

audio quality is important. we don't all use mp3s.
everybody gotta have the HDMI big screen TV though, right? DJs are more high tech with their home TV's than their sound. That's messed up.

Yeah I agree audio quality is important but it can only be as good as what your running it through and maybe its different in some places but on most sound systems I honestly don't think you could spot the difference in 8bit or 24bit and as for recording I guess the only advantage would be if you were using it for recording studio work..

on tractor, if you don't use automix, you have to actually beatmatch by ear... ?

well just like serato has the vertical waveforms

traktor has the BPM display also
so technically anyone can cheat my just changing the pitch until BPMs are the same.

but I guess its a lot harder to get a perfect clean mix because you dont have the two wave forms running side by side, when you can have a comparison when one track is running a bit faster than the other. So you kinda still have to rely on your ears to determine which track is going just a bit faster or slower.

But yes, in short, you can cheat with traktor
I just choose not to use BPM counters b/c its not too accurate with hip hop songs sometimes, and i can beatmatch by ear only =)

This is a question to aznchopstix how do u feel about the workflow in traktor because i have played around with traktor a few times and to me i believe the workflow in serato is much better in comparison but i just want to know ur input seeing how you more about traktor anyways.

i've seen a ton of vids on youtube about Tractor having huge issues durring gigs... find them...

oh... and i think it leans to the ugly side of appearance and how it is organized

I think the best reason is right here.

Or should I say hear?

serato.com

Hitler had a list, look what good came from that.

hahahahaa

this thread is hilarious... Serato is currently the leader but traktor is doing a fairly decent job considering they lost so much ground with final scratch 1 and 2. But as can noted with all the other DVS big on features...they are crap. It take time and talent to make GOOD solid features that are useable and reliable. Serato is the market leader right now and no one can deny this. Other companies have even tried to model this forum...And the best part you already own a Serato product most likely, and if I good tell you what was coming this year conversation would be over!

and if i could tell you what is coming in the not so distant future...LOL

this thread is hilarious... Serato is currently the leader but traktor is doing a fairly decent job considering they lost so much ground with final scratch 1 and 2. But as can noted with all the other DVS big on features...they are crap. It take time and talent to make GOOD solid features that are useable and reliable. Serato is the market leader right now and no one can deny this. Other companies have even tried to model this forum...And the best part you already own a Serato product most likely, and if I good tell you what was coming this year conversation would be over!

hahahahaa

......whats coming this year?

Lol hey ace have fun managing those pm"s now

ahhh is it something with ableton?

i dont KNOW anything just speculating that's all...

Dude next time you get on a list that the mods specifically tell you to keep on the hush don't mention anything they don't like that , it's a quick way to get put back on the not informed list. You don't see the rest of us saying anything about it

here are the clues...

Announced partnership with ableton (a year ago)
New SL3 (24 bit) very good for effects right?
Chad mention third deck...

the 57sl is based on the sl1....hmmmmm?
high demand for 4 channel mixers?

your guess is just as good as mines?

@ dj m bezzle....its all speculation I have no idea what's REALLY coming

damn ! thats more money i'll have to spend and I only just got a Macbook pro!

don't take this tooo far

Don't forget about the new pioneer gear the serato people had input on ;)

Wait ....you WERENT on the list...,,,,nevermind then

LOL

private me...

i dont care as long as u use a rane mixer like revolution does with your tractor your all good..


whooooppppss!!

I used Traktor Scratch Pro for 2 years until i switched over to Serato about 10 months ago. I was hesitant at first to make the switch, then once I did I realized it was the best decision I ever make. If people are worrying about effects, buy a mixer with on board effects, you can get a mixer like the behringerDDM4000 for less than 400 bucks that has plenty built in. When I used traktor i didnt even use the onboard effects, I used my djm800's effects. Serato is a superior for a few reasons.

1. if youre a club dj, almost every is set up for Serato, some club owners, such as Marquee in downtown manhattan (10th & 28th) wont even let non-serato dj's spin.

2. Serato is faster, and much much more reliable. Its unbelievably more stable than Traktor, for that reason I'm very happy i switched.

3. Serato is simple, easy to use, theres not much going on the screen.

4. Serato has 2 live decks, and the SP-6 sample player, which in reality allows serato dj's to spin with up to 8 decks and using Z, X,C,V,B,N can cue them instantly.

5. I have had Traktor Scratch Pro erase my library multiple times. Serato Automatically backs up my library so even if I use my portable harddrive and hook into someone elses computer, my overviews are already built.

6. Serato defines the Mobile DJ. Serato is a small file to download on anyones computer, a little over 5 megs, and all you need is your rane hardware and a portable harddrive and your ready to go. Traktor needs to be installed/verified with Native Instruments, otherwise it cuts off after 20 minutes.

What do you guys think?
What do you guys think?

So a Dj on tractor is clueless???? why???

I don't think it matters if you have serato, tractor, vdj, itch, CD's, LP's it all comes down to the DJ behind the decks, laptop, midi controller ect.. if you suck you're music is going to suck. But if you're bad ass you should be able to tear it up on any setup.

i had a conversation with a traktor scratch dj. he plays house.

his issues with traktor scratch includes
- registration
- slow version updates

he told me he's gettin sl3 soon.

i saw Craze and Klever tonight in ATL. they were both using traktor. to be honest i was jealous of the loop features and filter effects. they used them quite a bit for transitions and it sounded badass.

it honestly had me thinking of switching. but i don't want to. please come out with some sick shit serato. you're lagging behind at the moment.

and everyone should refrain from using the reliability argument. not one traktor user i've ever seen live has ever had a crash. that includes a show i saw with carl cox and 2000+ people.

lastly, to reiterate: i like serato/rane the best and want to continue supporting them.

What's different between seratos loop feature and traktors???

Traktor's looping is much more advanced and sophisticated. Assuming the songs' beat grids are correct, Traktor's loops don't drift out of sync like they do in SSL, loops (and cue points) in Traktor are quantized so you can jump between different loops/cues seamlessly without having to be super precise on the trigger timing, and you can swift loops forward or backwards X amount of beats or change the In/Out points X amount of beats on the fly.

Thanks konix on point as always lol..... I'm glad you mentioned the drifting loops in sl I always thought that was just me not knowing what I was doing lol

lol

just imagine the train wrecks that are in store for clubgoers as more ssl users try to use multiple loops in the sampler while simultaneously mixing two tracks. trainwreck might not even be the word for that anymore lol.

Here's few reasons: Long time ago i had my first Final Scratch (1) and i cost me a bomb it wasonly Linux & Mac based Software so i had to pay another $200 for the windows based software.....and i did....and then again few months later Final Scratch 2 pops out.....and what was i supposed to do with the mk1 version.....and then POOF few months later STANTON and NI split up......then what!?! I decided to join the Dark SIde.....which was few years ago and no complains since.....love my SL1 box love my TTM57 the only thing i've bought is the VSL......nothing more....i mean if you wanna do audio only you just buy the SL1 box and that's it...maybe you gonna get a new set of records later on and therewill be no more milking.....

One of my friends has Traktor Pro and I, Serato. We are going to swap for a bit to test one another out. I know he will have no problem installing my serato because of no registration. What am I going to encounter in attempting to install Traktor on my mac?? Any issues with registration or serial #?

Good luck on that one unless he has used up all his licence keys (I think it's three computers allowed with NI, at least my NFR key was) or deactivates his key to active yours. And that's a bitch n' a half doing considering you have to email NI support.


The beauty of Serato is the hardware is the KEY!

IMO, Tractor Scratch sounds better and the vinyl control is way superior to SL1. But on the other hand, I am not a fan of the screen layout, its too cluttered and seems a bit overwhelming at times. Both are great products tho, and both have their upsides and downsides. If the interface was a little cleaner and if it didnt take Traktor 5 tries to get it right, I might have switched over to traktor. But right now, I love the simplicty and stability or SSL.

img.photobucket.com

The SL-1 is 16-bit, not 12-bit.

The internal signal path and DSP in the TTM57 are 24-bit. The audio i/o (the data traveling on the USB cable) is 16-bit. That part isn't terribly relevant, because the vast majority of DJ's aren't playing material with any higher resolution than 16-bit anyway.

The sound quality of Scratch Live playing through the 57 has always been noticeably superior to that of the SL-1.

I joined this forum to get a sense of both sides of the fence regarding the serato / traktor debate, and on both SL/TSP forums there are people who stand by their product regardless of the bugs/pro/cons it has/hasn't. WHICH IS A MIND F**K.

I will be purchasing one of the two DVS's in the next month and as a EDM DJ in the Uk the ability to work multiple loops and quatized hot cue jumping is a MASSIVE appeal. I sooooooooo want to use TSP but what it really comes down to for me is what's the most reliable and what works best with my CDJs.

I'm sure the reliability for carl cox,dubfire,richie hawtin etc is great but their rocking macbook's that are probably tweaked and pushing 4/8gb ram by the company as their endorsers and can't be seen crashing at events.

Also have you noticed how the marketing of NI is all over the place for TSP?

If you search for serato on youtube there's always a traktor or X1 advert, same goes for illegal blogs(don't endorse these's btw). NI are even implementing serato library converters and SL templates for the X1 trying to sway current SL users.

Thoughts???

I think that is proof that NI isnt doing as well as they would like...

actually not only for the x1 but for tsp in general... NI built serato hotkeys to work with tsp? c'mon now... coming from an ex traktor pro user (NOT scratch pro) serato just plain and simple works better for me... ooooh cant forget the support team here is SOOO much better. BELIEVE ME. lol but at the end of the day its like coke and pepsi.

The only way you'll know for sure is to try both of them out.

To me, Traktor's heavy-handed "authorization" thing is itself more than enough reason for me not to want to use it. If I were to experience a hard drive crash at a gig and therefore had to switch to a backup, the very last thing I'd want to worry about is software authorization and the probability of having no internet connectivity to deal with that.

NI is definitely much more of a "marketing-oriented" company than either Serato or Rane. Serato and Rane seem to focus a lot more resources on making sure their products actually work as advertised.

^^ +1

i would acutually say rane was more marketing oriented they just dont pay for theirs, somehow they conned us all into doing it for free, if i made commission on every person i talked into buying SL i wouldnt have to work a day job anymore lol

its kinda like rane is tom sawyer and they make painting the fence look sooooooo fun...cept their painting CV

It is called evangelist marketing.
en.wikipedia.org

+1

If a company builds great products - you WANT to tell people how great they are. I went thru that with Apple since 1995, and did the same thing when I started using Serato.



I hate to say it, but you are coming in at a really bad time if you want to buy this month. I am cool and recently played with a lot of the big name Techno DJs that are in the videos on the NI website (Carl Craig, Pullen, Saunderson) so I saw them actually working and using the newer versions of Traktor with various controllers and internal effects. It was pretty intriguing, especially if you play EDM. It made me want to look closer at Traktor.

Serato JUST introduced effects in the new 2.0 Beta and will be introducing the Ableton Bridge soon, By this Fall (or early 2011), Serato will probably blow Traktor out of the water once they work out the bugs and minor glitches. I just glanced the sticky about the Beta 2.0 Custom FX presets and will probably be picking up the Traktor Kontrol X1 to use with Serato by the end of the month, looks exciting.

I would say lean towards Serato over Traktor look forward to the stability of the effects when the final release candidate comes out.

Well i purchased SL3 today after some deliberation with an Akai LPD8. Personally i want to push my Djing forward in a live situation making an impression and name along the so need the stability only SL can offer.

I played with Abelton (which i use for production) the other day in conjunction with DJing beat matching samples to tracks. I found it such a creative thing to do which got me thinking about possibilities in a live situation which was another plus for buying.

I can see myself buying a Akai APC40 in the future once i've got SL3 on lockdown.

+ 1000
Traktor is cool it has some real nice features it took some time to get used to but its not bad at all.
And you can record your set and you can use four decks

I think it's all about what you like and what makes you comfortable.
In went to dj in Texas and the dj had Torq. I loaded up my hard drive to his lap top and did a set with Torq it was cool and i have Serato and Tracktor
.
Its all about what you can afford and what you feel comfortiable djing with.

To keep it real get both I like serato better hand down!!!!

I like using traktor because it offers me a lot of options, If I don't want to bring a full set up, you can rock just with midi. never had a stability problem. Serato is cool too, but i think you guys are drinking the kool aid a little too much acting like traktor is being "blown out of the water"

personal preference in this forum bro alot of people will give you traktor pros and cons and serato pros and cons not like other forums bro, no kool aid here stop trollingwww.google.com

come on now, who's trolling. I just said that people tend to exaggerate the pros and cons a little too much. I have both serato and traktor, and I think that in general, I see more serato heads quick to hate on traktor, rather than the other way around.

Heres the deal, I used Traktor Scratch Pro for a year, before switching to serato, i've been using serato for a little over 6 months now.

The thing is, Traktor scratch is great, I really like the feel of the 2khz vinyl, and the quality of the soundcard.
The problem is, you need a supercomputer to run the system, and the GUI is very complex.

The thing i like about serato is, its simple, but it doesn't limit your options or opportunities, i feel like serato is back to the basics in a great way. Also, the workflow you can achieve with serato is 10000 times better, I also think that the vertical waveforms make a lot more since to me, then the phrase meter on TSP, but i use neither now.
Beatmatching by ear FTW.

All in all, there both really good systems, I think it comes down to preference. Mine is serato.

And when you're over on Traktor boards what do you see? You're on serato.com, of course there's going to be more heads that prefer Serato, if we didn't we'd be over there. But after preference that's pretty much where it ends with a few exceptions of shit disturbers (this thread included), most of us couldn't care less either way because it's just a tool. Yet I've seen the way Traktor users can carry on with some sort of little brother complex doing everything they can to make themselves feel better about the product they bought.

We don't need to do that over here for the most part because we're happy with what we bought, I don't need to slam another company that rarely so much as even enters my mind, and the only time it ever does is when it's actually mentioned here which is once is a blue moon. It barely exists to me. These are two different products that seem to be going different ways as they progress, the direction Serato takes captures my interest, what Traktor has to offer does not. Serato is more like minded to my needs so my pros and cons list is going to be different than the list of a deicated Traktor user. No online virtual gang war is going to change that. It's a figment of the imagination of some easily distracted individuals, nothing more.

You're the one coming in the thread acting as if there's some sort of line drawn in the sand between either users, yet when this thread started most of us shut it down right away.

Both software hardware packages rock. Have both and always carry them just in case. Take for instance last night had a misfortune of carrying a USB 1.0 cable on me and no USB 2.0 anywhere. Well plugged in SL3 with USB 1 and no show. Before I started panicking I remembered I have NI Audio 4 in my survival kit. Plugged it in and set the mixer to external and off I went rocking.

Love Serato's stability but at the same time Traktor have never crashed on me. If you do Old School, Soca and Riddim Reggae like I do often, Traktor works though I use SL3 85 percent of the time.

u dont need a list the name says it all

A lot of the reason for this is probably because a lot of Final Scratch/Traktor users in the early days (2004-2005) were pissed off about the dishonest marketing and "support" for those products that ended up wasting a lot of people's time. By comparison, the open, honest communication from the Serato developers (and much better software stability) was a huge breath of fresh air.

I have to assume that, with the technology maturing in general over the past 5 years, Traktor is probably less disfunctional/buggy than it was back then, but 1) my past experiences with NI leave me very little incentive to give them another chance and 2) I don't see that Traktor offers me anything I need over what SSL already has. Oh, and 3) looks like you still can't do video with Traktor.