yea, it'll be louder because it's essentially a pair of 18" driver working in conjunction.

Now if you want to go a pair of single 18s vs a dual 18, that would be closer.

Oh okay thank man appreciate the answer. Do you have any reccomendations as far as subwoofer in the same category and price point of the srx 218 or DAS aciton 118A. Something in the same wattage ratting too : 1000-1500 watts RMS .

Yorkville ES18P is probably the loudest single sub you can get in that price range. Doesn't go as low as the SRX, but goes a bit lower than the DAS Action.

You could probably also look for an old used Yorkville LS801P, but the newer ES18P sounds a lot better.

It will match the output of the SRX828, although the 828 will go a lot lower.

ES18p will match the output of the srx828. Also lighter and cheaper than the sxr828.

It's only like 5 lbs lighter so not a huge difference.

The casters on the SRX are a little easier to transport the sub than the 2 wheels that the ES18P has although you have to pay extra for casters on the SRX

But the size of SRX828 is a bit scary for a 1 man job.

honestly so is the ES18P. Better than the LS801P by far, but it's still really awkward to get in and out of a vehicle solo.

thank you al for the reply's & i will look into your reccomendations. I have some serious concerns:
1. If i buy dual 18 cabins, it would be perfect for my larger events, but if i take on a smaller event ( small vanue less than 150 people wedding), it would be to much.
2. It seems like buying two dual 18's gets you more bang for your buck, is this true ?
3. What's my best optoin as far as making my dollar stech ? two dual 18's and deal with the hassle of transporting them OR two single 18's that would be a little more versitile as far as transportation and smaller event usuability.
thank you all for your suggestions.

a double 18 is about the equivalent of a pair of single 18s (discounting the yorkville), so yea, a pair of SRX828 is pretty much like 4 SRX 818s. So you pay less to get the equivalent sound - only with less scalability.

You could always get the SRX828s and then grab a smaller 12" or 15" sub for your small gigs.

thanks dj Soo, what would you do ?

I guess it depends on your budget really.

4 single 18s would probably be ideal as it's the most scalable, but it's also the most expensive.

If you want really high end stuff, you could look at brands like bassboss, danely, or JTR, but they are really expensive.

I personally own 2 single 18" subs and a 12" sub, but the best I can do is midrange gear as the higher level stuff simply doesn't fit in my vehicle.

Im going tomorrow to check out out two srx 218 subwoofers that are second hand but are only 3k for both dual cabins.

i will see how heavy and useable the srx 218's are ; if not im probably going to go with DAS action 118a or vantec 18's. thank you for your opinions.

Now that im here, any tips and advice when checking out used equipment ? thanks alot

There's more to this than the size of the drivers. So many other factors to consider. For 1, the size of the room is the primary factor. If room size varies, then buy for a big room. You really can't have too much. For a small room, lower the volume.

For 2 and 3, as always, it depends. What dual 18's are you comparing? There's vast differences in quality. With bass, its all about how much air needs to be moved to make a certain note in a certain room. You can take an average 18 inch speaker driven by an average amp, and put it next to a better quality 12 inch speaker and better amp, not only can you equal the performance of the 18 inch setup, you can easily surpass it. All other factors being equal, if you can make a smaller driver move the same amount of air as a larger driver, there's no difference. Its the same thing.

Obviously, you have a budget to work with, as do we all. My advice would be to buy the best separates you can afford, and not go with self powered. Even if it means you have to buy a 12 or 15 inch speaker. This leaves you with upgrade options. For example, subs need a lot of power. If you can only afford a modest amp now, in the future, it can be upgraded. A better amp will make the subs you already sound much better. In the long run, it will be more cost effective because you don't have to buy everything all at once.

There's other ways to go about this, and you should pick what works best for you. But if the choice were mine, this is how I would do it.

thanks man , appreciate it.

I would not recommend getting smaller amps than you need unless you really know how to run them properly. Having an underpowered amp is just as dangerous as an over powered one. If you run it hard into clipping, it will send square sine waves to the speakers, which will overheat them and burn up the voice coils. This can happen in a matter of minutes.

First, what are your needs? Weddings, small parties, bigger pubs & clubs? Figure out how much sound you need for most of the gigs you do. With Prosumer gear, powered is the way to go. It is easier to run and has built in protections to keep you from blowing up your gear. For example, most of the small-medium weddings, events, pubs & clubs I do can be handled by a single Yorkville LS801p. 250+ people or club level sound levels require a second one. If I need more, I rent additional Yorkvilles. I only owned one Yorkville sub for several years. I also own smaller subs & tops for smaller gigs & bigger, more powerful passive P.A. for bigger, club type events.
When you get to high end, high powered P.A., passive gear makes has benefits and is cheaper in the long run.

"Having an underpowered amp is just as dangerous as an over powered one."

That's not entirely true. Under powering is far more dangerous than over powering speakers. At least 90% of all blown drivers are due to under powering. Over powering is user error. As long as you have volume/gain controls, blowing the speaker is entirely up to the user.

The best check is to listen to the system. One of the easiest things to here is an amp that is being pushed too hard. Depending on the design, you will hear a harsh, glassy type of sound, or a rounded off, loud, but not dynamic type of sound. Either way, its very easy to hear, and you need to lower the volume.

This is only correct a low listening levels. As soon as you start turning the level (volume) up, the DISTORTION of the 12" driver dramatically increases, since the distance the cone has to move (vs an 18" driver) is huge.

Can the difference be made smaller if the 12" has a lightweight kevlar cone and huge magnet assembly vs an 18" with heavy cone and a small magnet. Yes, but you cannot completely circumvent the Laws of Physics.

Despite all the new hype (DSP's, Class D amps, etc.), very little has changed for low frequency subs - you still get to pick only two of the following three parameters - small, low , loud. To get "low" and "loud", you need "big", there is no way around it.

"This is only correct a low listening levels. As soon as you start turning the level (volume) up, the DISTORTION of the 12" driver dramatically increases, since the distance the cone has to move (vs an 18" driver) is huge."

That may be true, but not always. Quality of drivers, type of cabinet, quality of the amp, etc, all play a huge factor.

"Can the difference be made smaller if the 12" has a lightweight kevlar cone and huge magnet assembly vs an 18" with heavy cone and a small magnet. Yes, but you cannot completely circumvent the Laws of Physics."

You have it right. Its a good example, and its not necessary to circumvent the laws of physics. You may have to spend some money, but it can be done. Is it a good value? That's up to the buyer. If you have a mobile DJ that's willing to pay more for smaller cabinets, it may be worth it. We each have to make our own decisions on that one.

"Despite all the new hype (DSP's, Class D amps, etc.), very little has changed for low frequency subs - you still get to pick only two of the following three parameters - small, low , loud. To get "low" and "loud", you need "big", there is no way around it."

On this, I disagree. You leave out 2 critical parameters. The room. Small rooms don't need tons of equipment. You clearly know enough about this that I don't have to explain that one. But now that I think about it, I am being biased and didn't catch it. I live in NYC and most of our clubs tend to have smaller rooms. Even big clubs are sometimes broken up into smaller sections.

The other factor you didn't mention, is the quality of bass. Low and loud is one thing, but definition is something else. A real world example would be 2 very well known clubs here in NY. Unfortunately, neither is open anymore, but enough people know them, they still make good examples. The Twilo system was considered by many to be one of the best in the world. The bass had such brutal definition to it, I can't tell you how many times I had to run to the bathroom and throw up. It was wonderful. Compared to other clubs, they really didn't use big speakers. They used what they had very well. Then there was the Sound Factory system. Played as loud and low as any of them, but the bass was muddy and ill defined. The room was part of the problem, but the system was just big and poorly implemented.

I did mention it in my first paragraph, it's called "distortion". What you call "definition" is really just lack of distortion, and like frequency response, is a measurable quantity...unlike "definition" which isn't - although I agree with you - you'll know it when you hear it!

In it's simplest terms, "distortion" is the difference between the output of a speaker vs. it's electrical input. It can measured near-field with a calibrated microphone and a dual trace scope. Unfortunately for us DJ's, it is also usually measured at way too low a level to be of value. Without getting into all the physics, suffice it to say that the further a speaker driver has to move, the worse it gets. This is the main reason horn loaded loudspeakers have so much lower modulation distortion than direct radiators, although they can bring their own set of problems.

However, "all things being equal", and assuming the magnet/voice coils are similar, the OP will be best served by using the larger driver and the larger box, as long as it fits in his car!

just a question..and i know next to nothing about this...but the sound factory and twilo were the same building, and the utilized the room in the same way, and even had the speakers positioned the same way (4 stacks , one on each corner of the dance floor), so how could have not been the room that was problem for the sound factory? i, for one, thought the sound factory sounded way better. i had been there many times..i was only in twilo once,. and they had something covering each stack and it sounded muffled to me. but " sound good" is very subjective . and that " send me to the bathroom" thing happened to me in the sound factory many times! lol.

It all started on 27th st with a club called Paradise Garage. That turned into the original Sound Factory, and then Twilo (and Spirit after that). The Twilo system was installed by a company called Phazon, and was their flagship system. At the time, it was considered the best system in the US. (By pretty much everyone that heard it. I don't know if there was any type of official rating.)

Most people know the Sound Factory in the building on 46th st. That's the location it was moved to when Twilo opened. It was a much bigger building and the main dance floor was at the bottom with a very high ceiling that went up several stories. Around the perimeter, there were walkways that went up for several levels. Its hard to explain, but it was an extremely difficult room to get right because the bass would just load up and drown everything out. Eventually, they brought in a local company called GSC (if I remember correctly), and they did a really good job fixing it, but the room still had limitations and was never quite as good as some of the other high end systems in NY. Eventually, SF was closed down, and re-opened as Pacha. It closed down again and now the people that own Space are probably going to take it over.

My comparison was with Twilo on 27th and SF on 46th.

"I did mention it in my first paragraph, it's called "distortion". What you call "definition" is really just lack of distortion, and like frequency response, is a measurable quantity...unlike "definition" which isn't - although I agree with you - you'll know it when you hear it!"

You did mention it, but the problem is that there are different types of distortion. Some can be measured, and others can't. This is the quote I was responding to.

"This is only correct a low listening levels. As soon as you start turning the level (volume) up, the DISTORTION of the 12" driver dramatically increases, since the distance the cone has to move (vs an 18" driver) is huge."

The type of measurable distortion you are referring to can be minimized with better quality design, parts and amp. It may cost a lot, but it can certainly be done. On this, it appears that we agree. I was also factoring in some of the intangibles.

Sorry, but I forgot to mention that phase distortion is also a big deal (and measurable) when dealing with low frequencies.

bro...please don't take this the wrong way....u obviously forgot more about technical sound then i will ever know...but when it comes to club history? its so wrong i dint know where to begin...but lets start here...

'It all started on 27th st with a club called Paradise Garage"

WTF!!!!!!
the paradise garage started , lived , and ended at 84 King st.
no opinions , no that's the street we call 27th st in our generation, NO!!!!!!!
so obviously that makes the statement
"That turned into the original Sound Factory"
WRONG.
not to assume from nothing , but kinda safe to say that u didnt live this from its beginnings because the statement
"Most people know the Sound Factory in the building on 46th st"
again ...WTF?
thats like," babe who? aaron judge is the greatest yankee ever"
no wonder u said SF < TW..Twilo was great for the generation of techno , harder forms of house, etc...but the ORIGINAL SOUND FACTORY was a world famous, legendary, club for ALL OF DANCE MUSIC that has a legacy that if it didnt exist, all forms of dance music itself would be different . you mention it w the Garage, etc. and to say most people know SF for the ione on 46th st? MOST PEOPLE THAT KNOW THE ONE ON 27TH ST DONT EVEN KNOW THERE WAS ONE BAD ATTEMPT ON 46TH ST. and sound system? they tuned the one on 27th street all day every day for 6 months before they opened and was known to be the best in the world at the time and it was undisputed . Pacha was a successful dance club as well, but again, dance music or even any form of ir wouldn't be different if it never existed.
i know that technically , these are of a lot of opinion, but its really not, please never enter into a conversation about club and music history and say some of these things...blasphmous is an understatement on most , and so wrong on others that a person would think u were joking...kinda like if i challenge your sound knowledge .
please dont be mad at me...

"kinda like if i challenge your sound knowledge "

You don't know enough to do that.

"MOST PEOPLE THAT KNOW THE ONE ON 27TH ST DONT EVEN KNOW THERE WAS ONE BAD ATTEMPT ON 46TH ST."

It was 3x the size of Twilo (at least), and was packed to the point where sweat would rain down from the ceiling. It took a half hour just to walk to the bathroom.

I don't know what you are getting so upset about. Everything I mentioned is true. Here's a link with pics, names, addresses, sound system, dates, etc. Any more questions, just ask and I'll be happy to set the record straight.

the-sound-factory.blogspot.com

you dont know enough to challenge my history knowledge...
i dint care how big it was.....dude the original was open until 2pm THE NEXT DAY...
i dont gotta read a blog spot, but i did go to your link..
you do realize ur proving MY point!!!!!
like it said
1989-1995....thats the original!!!!!!
stick to your lane..this is mine
any comment about that delirious fiction about the paradise garage was the first club in that space?
if i put Diplo somewhere he's gonna outdraw Larry Levan , does that make him better ?
you know better than using numbers out if context.
at least hope so.

and go read the blogspot ...they had the phazon FIRST

its funny that u say
"Everything I mentioned is true."
but u didnt even come back about half the stuff i showed u was in error.
and what u did attempt to, u said different in your original statements , and then said read theat blog, its all there,
but that blog is telling u the greatness of the original
the original that none of this can surpass.
its all there for YOU TO READ.
not twilo, or that fake ass SF on 46th st, or Pacha
one thing u youngins always miss is everything besides nu,mbers. ITS THE PEOPLE AND THE VIBE THAT MAKE IT LEGENDARY...these places are promoted to be that they want u to believe they are. I'm sorry . NONE OF THEM are organic. NONE.
if u weren't there u wouldn't understand. every place u mentioned , i was there .u want ur experiences to be the greatest i guess because telling them i guess validates you. but when ur wrong , ur wrong..dont change history.or attempt to. it started at 84 King st. the second generation was SF on 27th... and music and the music game became so different after that , it can never be comaparable. after 27th st closed they moved that party right down 27th st to the tunnel for a little while, junior and all. you going on stories . im going on experience. you're experience , from u telling it, is sound. not mine. and u never heard the real SF system. im sure that now, it probably couldn't compare to some b bigger, better ones now, BUT THAT DONT MEAN THE PARTY WAS BETTER.

Why don't we just say you win. I can't compete with what you remember. To be honest, I just responded in detail because very few people talk about these places anymore, and it was nice to think about them again. I'm sorry I brought it all up.

You have it right. It was GSA. They really did do a good job in the SF. It was a very difficult room to get right.