Serato DJ Pro General Discussion

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 Serato DJ Pro General Discussion
Problem: MIDI controllers - apparently, there can only be one?
Talk about Serato DJ Pro, expansion packs and supported hardware

Problem: MIDI controllers - apparently, there can only be one?

Voyager529 5:39 PM - 6 November, 2014
Hello, Serato folk!

So I took the plunge last week and attempted to use Serato DJ at an event, because beat grids are super handy =). The problem I encountered was this:

Normally I use two MIDI controllers: a pair of Dicers for cue points and looping, and an AKAI LPD-8 for effects and gain knobs. This setup works very well for me, and works the first time, every time, in Scratch.

When I plugged it all into Serato DJ, it was happy with the LPD-8, but the Dicers didn't work. I tried every USB port with both units, no luck - I was LPD-8 only. The department of "ain't no one got time for that" took the first "Nope" train out of "Nopeville" and back to Scratch Live, with which I rocked out the party until the rain came and took care of /that/ quick, fast, and in a hurry.

The next time I started DJ up, I only plugged in the Dicers, and I was able to do my thing. It seems that the two of them are both compatible with DJ, but not concurrently.

Is there a known workaround for this? am I stuck not using my LPD-8? Is it only that MIDI controller and another similar unit would perform better? Am I missing something else entirely?

Thank you for your consideration.

Joey


Specs:
Rane SL3 / Technics 1200s
Akai LPD8 MIDI controller
Novation Dicers
Serato DJ 1.7.1
Windows 8.1 x64
Intel Core i7 3.2GHz Bloomfield
12GB DDR3 RAM
Samsung 250GB system SSD / Crucial 240GB music SSD / 1TB Hitachi storage HDD
nVidia GeForce 460M
3xUSB 2.0 ports, Intel northbridge
2xUSB 3.0, Renesas chipset
dj_soo 9:34 AM - 9 November, 2014
I regularly use dicers with a lpd8 or an sp1 - no problems..
deejdave 7:39 AM - 10 November, 2014
No workaround needed for me. I normally use SP-1 by itself but I have USED my X1's (pair) as well as aki controllers and other generics at the same time no issues.
Serato, Support
Martin C 9:39 PM - 4 December, 2014
Hey Voyager529,

If you only use your USB 2.0 ports for the LPD8 and Dicers, then connect your SL3 to the USB 3.0 would it work?

Users can definitely have more than one controller - but you can run into configuration issues and limitations sometimes, especially with Windows computers. We can try a few things though, like updating USB port drivers, BIOS or just trying to find a different combination of ports until you find one that works.
Voyager529 4:32 PM - 10 December, 2014
Hello Martin! Thank you for the response! (Appreciate the feedback from Dave and Soo as well)

While my laptop can still run circles around most Serato-running laptops, its 2011 vintage means that it's unlikely for me to see driver updates for either USB controller - both were last updated in early 2013, and neither Clevo nor Renesas appear to have written new drivers since. My BIOS is in a similar boat.

My tendency thus far has been to put all three (SL3, Dicers, LPD8) on the 2.0 controller due to class compliant drivers - i.e. it's part of the chipset while 3.0 is technically a PCI device (by extension, I can't boot off a USB flash drive from the 3.0 ports). SSL has had no issues whatsoever with this setup, so it never occurred to me to try to segregate them in that manner. I might have incidentally done that during the troubleshooting process while I was at the party, but I wasn't exactly keeping score because I was in panic mode.

I'll probably have my decks out this weekend for a jam session with a friend, so I'll be certain to try it out then. Additionally, I just downloaded the SDJ 1.7.2 release, which may also be of assistance.

I'll let you know what I find. Thanks for the feedback.

Best,
Joey
Serato, Support
Martin C 4:38 AM - 15 December, 2014
Hey Joey,

Let us know how your jam sessions goes with 1.7.2!

While its true the Dicers and LPD8 use class compliant drivers, the SL3 does not. I would always recommend that the SL3 is directly connected to the computer rather than a hub, as this is your most important component in terms of keeping the music going :)

Cheers,

Martin
nikodb 9:34 AM - 14 January, 2015
Dont mean to hack in here...but I can also verify that a combo of native or not, hardware devices duplicating controls can give issues....It seems very prominent if you either connect two native devices giving similar controls (e.g. Hot Cues) or if you double map any control to a non native device. Buttons can loose functionality, kight feedback and you have to re plug things to make it work.

Examples i have are

Dn HC1000s connected among with an AKAI AFx (Hangs between the pads of the two controllers and light feed troubles)

AKAI AFX connected with a DDJ SP1 and Dicers (DDJ SP! & AKAI loosing pad functionality, Dicers sometimes recycle and one side lost though generally the most stable to work on)

AKAI AMx connected with LPD8 sync mapped on LPD (Lost Sync Light feedback on the AMx )

In generally problems seem to be triggered with any device connecting while duplicating controls. Workaround is usually to reconnect the non responsive hardware and choose where you want to be using what (eg Hot Cues etc) If you start hitting things all over the place, they will get stuck again. It almost feels as if devices are fighting each other for the controls :P//// Macbook Pro i7 2001 and Belkin powered hub used.


Cheers
Nik
nikodb 9:41 AM - 14 January, 2015
P.S.

A description to a different issue, but that's kind of exactly of whats happening also to multiple native devices connected. that duplicate controls for most of the times...Watchwww.youtube.com

Cheers
Nik
deejdave 6:26 PM - 14 January, 2015
Well said and I agree. It seems to make perfect sense. Think of it like the real world. If you have a set of friends who are different in every way then you have a set of identical twins who would you rather be a sports caster for? Sure when their back is towards you you can tell their numbers but facing front you wouldn't know who's who! LOL I don't know why I though this up haha.

Anyways I have never experienced this so I couldn't tell you BUT I have two thoughts on this.

1.) If anyone experiences issues such as these I have heard doing this may help support.serato.com

2.) This is probably the EXACT reason one must install the CDJ aggregator when using two Pioneer CDJ's................ so they DON'T get mixed up.

I was actually even nervous when using the SP1 with my SX or SZ due to the similarity but alas no issue occurred to my delight.
nikodb 8:03 PM - 14 January, 2015
Cdj Aggragator is used when you want to use multiple cdj sound-cards in order to set multiple output devices on your Mac..has nothing to do with the HID control function we use here with CDjs...Aggragator is used because MACs do not really support multiple sound cards output, the way windows very straightforward do...it just simplifies things so you wont have to go in to the MAC MIDI utility to manually set the cdjs as sound-cards

I am not so sure what you mean with your twins and the bunch of friends example..This problem did not exist till lately..If MIDI controls (even for the same notes) were on a different channel, you had no conflicts what so ever in anyway...and as for identical midi devices mapped or HIDed on similar things even while transmitting on the same channel, they were just duplicating things with no problems as such...

Cheers
Nik
deejdave 8:18 PM - 14 January, 2015
Quote:
Cdj Aggragator is used when you want to use multiple cdj sound-cards in order to set multiple output devices on your Mac..has nothing to do with the HID control function we use here with CDjs...Aggragator is used because MACs do not really support multiple sound cards output, the way windows very straightforward do...it just simplifies things so you wont have to go in to the MAC MIDI utility to manually set the cdjs as sound-cards

I suppose you are correct.

For some reason or another I read you were using identical midi devices. Carry on ........Nothing to see here........... LOL

In looking back I don't even know what triggered that thought. Using multiple Midi should not be a problem though. Not something I have seen much of. Again I thought you were speaking of using two same midi controllers which IS something I have heard MANY have issues with and is also why I used the twins analogy as it makes sense that identical items would cause conflicts........................ I apologize though and carry on.

You are 100% correct this should NOT be but in all honesty I can not help here as I do not experience this issue. I have not used any generic midi controllers or sub controllers in combination but I have used quite a few native.

Reloop Neon,
DDJ-SP1
Akai AFX
Serato Remote

all with no issues when combined with even similar devices (SX, SZ, NS7II etc.)

The ONLY issues I ever had that i can remember was using the DDJ-SX with my Ableton Push and the SX was then playing notes on Ableton via sending the same signals. This can be fixed within the midi setup though AND this was with SDJ 1.5 I believe.


Sorry I can not be of much more help though and in essence probably wasted a bit of your time as I know you are probably frustrated as it is.
nikodb 8:48 PM - 14 January, 2015
Nah no frustration man..I always have a working set of things to go....i just happen to experiment a lot and giving feedback on these things, as i do own a bunch of modular native devices my self, all built around Serato. I d like to keep my options open when it comes to choosing what i ll be getting to work without thinking, this may or may not work with the other..

I have also been using identical midi devices with no problems in the past, as long as they transmitted on a different channel/layer there were no issues....Its only lately that SDj is giving trouble with multiple midi devices connected...and with that said, i mean no conflicts by same notes hitting the SDJ interface (eg HotCues trigering cause the other device specific note is native on Hot Cues)...i mean a whole device is getting stuck on native accessories combo.

Anyway i am sure they can duplicate this fairly easy and put it on their log

Cheers
Nik