Software help archive

A read-only archive of old serato.com help threads.

Digital meters in Serato not reading relative to audio files with the Sl-3

Product
Scratch Live
Version
1.9.2
Hardware
Rane SL3
Computer
Mac
OS
Platform
-
SonicSupreme 8:53 PM - 13 March, 2010
Product: scratchlive
Version: 1.9.2
Hardware: scratchlive-sl3
Computer: mac
OS Version: 10.5.8
---

I just started using the Sl3 & I'm trying to figure out why the digital meters in Serato are reading differently than the SL-1. Is this purposely done this way or is this a bug? With the Sl 1 if I had a WAV file that peaks naturally @ -.01 or -.02 than the digital meter in Serato would go almost all the way to the top. If it was an Mp3 peaking @ 0, you would see the meters hitting the read here & there. With the SL3 a file that peaks at 0 naturally reads differently on the digital meter in Serato---It goes up about 3/4 up the meter in stead of all the way up. What exactly is going on here? I do not want to use the auto gain function. I will use my mixer's input gain switch for that. But I need to know that the files integrity is kept intact & that there is no automatic attenuation going on with the audio files when i connect the SL 3.
SonicSupreme 8:55 PM - 13 March, 2010
The other reason I ask this is because the digital meters in Serato are not numbered so I don't know what reference I'm reading.
Konix 9:09 PM - 13 March, 2010
This is how it's supposed to be. The SL3 has a hotter/louder output than the SL1.
SonicSupreme 11:14 PM - 13 March, 2010
Konix i appreciate u answering . I can hear that the SL 3 is louder but that still doesn't answer my question. My question (to make it easier) is why don't the meters hit digital "0" or right underneath digital zero (@ -.01 for example) when the file clearly was mastered like that. The gain switch is still @ "Unity Gain." (right in the center)...Why are my meters going up 75% of the way when with the Sl-1 the meters were reading correctly relative to the file playing.
Konix 1:37 AM - 14 March, 2010
Well, as a sort of stated, the SL3 has a lot more headroom than the SL1. The meters will not be the same with the SL1 and SL3. I'll have to find the thread where a Serato mod explains why specifically, but just know that the level meter differences between the SL1 and SL3 is intentional and by design.
Rane, Support
Chad S. 6:15 PM - 15 March, 2010
Headroom is the answer. You have more of it with the SL-3. So even though the levels look slightly lower, they are at the same Db as your SL-1 would play them.
SonicSupreme 6:12 AM - 16 March, 2010
Headroom. ok so if I raise the gain switch & the meters almost barely touching the red, how are we achieving that gain? Because if it's doing it digitally to the file than there's gonna be some clipping to the signal & that would be disastrous especially at a time when music is so hyper-compressed....
SonicSupreme 6:13 AM - 16 March, 2010
...or is the gain switch affecting some component in the SL-3 box?
Rane, Support
Chad S. 3:23 PM - 16 March, 2010
Think of a 8 oz cup and a 10 oz cup.

You can pour 8 oz into the 10 oz cup and still have more room to fill it without spilling over.

That is the Sl-1 and the SL-3 with volume. Does that help?
SonicSupreme 6:56 PM - 17 March, 2010
Chad. it doesn't help. I know what headroom means . If I take just the USB switch & switch it between both hardware units using the same song & without touching anything else, I am getting a hotter output out of the SL-3 so what do you mean by "they are at the same Db as your Sl-1 would play them"-----It's certainly not spitting the same Db. I just put the signal in Pro-Tools as I'm doing some tests & I gotta tell you that the first thing I'm noticing here is that my waveforms are inverted between the Sl-1 & the Sl-3's output--What is that all about?
Rane, Support
Chad S. 7:12 PM - 17 March, 2010
[

What do you mean by "signals inverted" in pro tools? Can you attach a screen shot?
SonicSupreme 8:12 PM - 17 March, 2010
img294.imageshack.us

If u see carefully the top is the Sl-1 (L& R)& the bottom is Sl-3 (L & R). The waveforms are completely inverted to each other(180 degrees)--& trust me it wasn't a mistake on my part--this is coming out of both Left outputs out of both units using the same rca cable (red to red--white to white). I gotta leave now but when I get back, I am testing the right outputs & I need to transfer the original file digitally here on Pro-tools to see which is the correct polarity.
Rane, Support
Chad S. 8:17 PM - 17 March, 2010
how are you running it into protools?

Are you using one of the AUX channels on the SL-3?

If so, do you have that dip switch on the SL-3 set to Line?
SonicSupreme 9:50 AM - 18 March, 2010
Chad, Im not using the Aux input nor Aux output of the SL3. I am running Serato in internal mode so there is nothing going into the inputs of either SL1 or SL3. The dipswitches on the SL3 were all down (Line Mode) & I even did a test with them up (Phono Mode)--but that's not really changing anything in the output of the SL3---That's for the Phono input preamp only correct? Chad--is there anything else I might be missing?

It turns out the original file's polarity is right on the SL3 & wrong on the SL1
Rane, Support
Chad S. 4:08 PM - 18 March, 2010
You are correct about the inputs not effecting what we are after.

Are you using the same RCA cord to connect the SL-1 and the SL-3? If not, could be a cord issue. If so, might be an output issue.
SonicSupreme 4:27 PM - 18 March, 2010
Same exact cord just switching between SL1 & SL3.
Rane, Support
Chad S. 5:25 PM - 18 March, 2010
Same inverted signal from both outputs of the SL-1?
SonicSupreme 6:05 PM - 18 March, 2010
Yeah. same inverted signal from both outputs of the SL 1. The only way I would've ever found that out was doing this test between the SL 1 & the SL 3.
SonicSupreme 7:37 PM - 18 March, 2010
Hey you know what---Even though now I wanna get the SL-1 fixed, I still didn't get my original question answered & I'm a lil disturbed that I'm not really hearing the 24-bit quality coming out of the SL-3 compared to the SL-1. All I'm hearing is a louder file--more squashed ---less 3 dimensional---I'm not hearing the dynamic effect of the music going down far enough & coming back & slamming the top because part of it sounds slammed already. From what I'm hearing the SL-1 actually sounds more 24 bit than the SL-3. The SL-3 has less dynamics than the SL-1. I could definitely hear it & I even used theTT Dynamic range meter to prove that to myself visually. Either I'm doing something wrong or my SL-3 isn't working properly. So Chad if u come up with something go ahead but as for now I'm sticking with what my ears are my telling me. I'm gonna do even further tests now with 24 bit files that I recorded from Vinyl a while back with a UA 2192 A/D converter----See how they come out sounding out of the SL1 & SL3 because at that point I should definitely hear the extra depth from the 24-bits that the SL-3 should be giving me compared to the SL-1.