Seriously considering selling serato and buying cdjs

icecoololly 2:31 PM - 6 July, 2006

Hi everyone, I have owned serato for about 6 months, and while it is absolutely incredible I am slowly getting more annoyed with it.

I am using Technics 1210 M3Ds and I find I can mix real records on them perfectly. I can keep them matched for a minute or more. However when I mix with serato, the pitch seems to change so much, I have got them perfectly matched and then it'll drift behind, so I nudge it exactly like i would a normal record, but it seems that serato is way too sensitive because it'll then be too far ahead. Also, when I am mixing it sometimes seems to skip randomly so that it is out of time. Is that due to my control records?

What could be causing these problems? Would they be due to my relatively old computer? I am using an 867MHz Powerbook G4 with 512Mb RAM. I am planning to upgrade to a MacBook soon. Should I also consider replacing my carts? I am using Ortofon Elektro's and they are about 9 months old. Considering they were my first proper carts they have taken a bit of a beating. I suppose that if serato is more sensitive then slight damage to the needles that doesnt really affect real vinyl could possibly cause serato to be inaccurate.

I have been considering buying cdjs, I have used serato with cdplayers before and I have never been disappointed, maybe I could keep serato and buy cheap cdjs, but that kinda defeats the object of serato, since I could then just carry cds.

Please, any opinions are greatly appreciated. Thanks, Olly

Konix 2:49 PM - 6 July, 2006

Could be due to old control vinyls. Hold old are they? What does the tracking indicator/percentage say? I doubt it's the needles or your computer.

Also what kind of songs are you playing? Vinyl rips or CD rips? If vinyl rips, keep in mind that the recordings themselves will have minor pitch flucuations, then you have to add to that the minor pitch flucuations from the Technics playing the control vinyl. Combined it's still small, but enough to throw you off.

sixxx 4:52 PM - 6 July, 2006

I'm with Konix on this one. Be sure to check how worn your control records are first, then go from there.

G-man NYC 7:27 PM - 6 July, 2006

9 month old orto's and worn out control records = bad performance. If you're going to use vinyl you gotta maintain your records and needles.

I recently broke my finger so i had to use the CDJ1000's for a while instead of vinyl and I actually grew to like the combo of SSL and the CDj's. No needles to replace, no worn out vinyl, no feedback/threshold issues and using the loops and cue points on the CDj's made for interesting mixing possibilities that you can't really do with vinyl. Scratching is a little weird but I'm not q-bert or anything so if you're not trying to be either... maybe the cdj is for you.

icecoololly 9:58 PM - 6 July, 2006

ok, thanks everyone, I shall invest in some new needles and give my records a good clean. If this doesnt improve then I'll try new records. But I am prepared to give serato more chances just because it is incredible

BassChamber 10:18 PM - 6 July, 2006

check the scope views, it should be perfect clear and rounded...

icecoololly 3:56 PM - 7 July, 2006

The mp3s im playing are all either cd rips or legal digital downloads.

As regards the scope views... Pics of mine are here: is this normal?

www.bath.ac.uk
www.bath.ac.uk
www.bath.ac.uk

as you can see they arent 100% sharp

icecoololly 4:05 PM - 7 July, 2006

ok, to avoid being told to look at the example scope displays in the sticky in this forum, I will just post to say that I have already checked the example scope displays, and I am just asking for confirmation that the scope views that I have posted are probably caused by old damaged needles and/or dirty worn control records...?

JayB1200 4:08 PM - 7 July, 2006

yeah , check out some new needles... and whats up with your buffer all the way at 20???

Konix 4:13 PM - 7 July, 2006

Yes the scopes look decent, but a little fuzzy. I'd try to clean the needles and control vinyls. And yeah why the 20 buffer? That's a high latency. I'd lower that to at least 10.

icecoololly 4:13 PM - 7 July, 2006

i was experimenting with it at the extremes, and also I was having drop outs alot, but that was (as is mentioned in another topic) probably caused partially by knackered needles

Maestro & Chaos 7:26 PM - 7 July, 2006

Might want to take your technics in for service...

nik39 7:43 PM - 7 July, 2006

ice, they look okay, I would say clean your vinyls, like Konix suggested.

icecoololly 8:42 PM - 7 July, 2006

Quote:

ice, they look okay, I would say clean your vinyls, like Konix suggested.

Yeah ;) I gave them a thorough clean today with some proper stuff that my dad has for his record collection. And I have got some replacement needles in the post, coming soon.

Quote:

Might want to take your technics in for service...

I had been thinking about this. I bought them second hand and I think they could do with a service. Is it possible that older phono cables and dirty circuit boards are causing a little bit of interferance?

Thanks for all the replies and advice, Olly

dj KarrsiN 9:30 AM - 8 July, 2006

Quote:

Hi everyone, I have owned serato for about 6 months, and while it is absolutely incredible I am slowly getting more annoyed with it.

Are you NUTS!!! Why in the world would you want to sell your serato? OMG, someone needs to slap some sense into you!! :P Just kidding.......

Yes, check needles, clean your tone arm connection, check the anti skating and weights, clean your control records, make sure you ground cables are well grounded.

I know it might be a pain at first buy, once you get all this down, it's well worth it. The thing about ssL, is that your gear has to be well maintained in order for it to work well.

Dj KaGeN 2:09 AM - 10 July, 2006

SSL will force you as a DJ to be aware of many more things in order for it work properly and flawlessly for that matter. Miss wired headshells - bad contacts - tired tonearms - your needles and the burn in factor of your records. If your gear is in tip top shape, finding your issue should be rather easy. The digital days are more advanced than the days of analog.

Sam 7:01 AM - 11 July, 2006

(*marked unresolved)
let us know how you get on Olly

SuspectWhatever 1:41 PM - 11 July, 2006

Deja Vu, I am having this exact same problem, I have tried various different solutions, changing my laptop, mixer, various different settings on my computer and many more. I dont think it is to do with the control vinyls as I have rarely used the B side and the problem still exists when turning the record over which rules out wear and tear.

Mixing with normal vinyl is perfect with records staying in time for the whole song once pitched correctly. Serato records however, have to be constantly adjusted, it is making me crazy.

The only thing I havent tried is changing the needles, I am using ortofon concordes which have taken a bit of a battering over the years so will try this before totally giving up.

icecool, if you manage to find a solution to this I would be very grateful...

Very unhappy serato user.

Dj KaGeN 3:33 PM - 11 July, 2006

Please keep in mind that SSL is a hunter of equipment flaws. To enter the digital domain your shizzle has to be spot on. Correctly wired tonarms, the 4 wires on the headshell, your decks need to spin true, the needle wear factors in, the sound environemnt that transfers back to the needle is even part of the equation. I know I'm making this sound like damn rocket science to get it all to function properly, it's not really. It's just that tolerences for perfection do have to met or you will notice small issues. The thing to remeber, is that you are striving for perfection just for a 'vinyl emulartion tool'. But now that you mention it, I think I have just grown accustom to slightly tweaking the pitch during very long mixes, whereas 2 years ago I'd strive for set it and forget it pitch control. The collection I now walk in with grossly outweighs the crates and wear and tear on me.

icecoololly 10:43 PM - 11 July, 2006

hey everyone, I have now been testing my new needles and clean records for a couple of days, and I can say that it has improved it no end. I think I still need to get my decks serviced, but I would definately advise SuspectWhatever to try new needles.

Thanks for the support and advice. I have definately learned a lot about serato!

I do have a question though. I was recording a mix the other day and I had a series of awful dropouts. I can post the audio here in a few minutes, but basically I had the new needles and clean records. My laptop was running on its power cable (not battery) and yet I still had these awful dropouts.

Dj KaGeN 10:46 PM - 11 July, 2006

did you notice the little USB light near the top when it happened?

icecoololly 11:22 PM - 11 July, 2006

www.bath.ac.uk

Here you go, I can't remember looking for the light, but I can't think what else this could be, the file normally plays fine

Zach S 6:10 PM - 12 July, 2006

icecoololly,

Check this thread >>>www.scratchlive.net
Please help us help you to get this problem resolved:)

icecoololly 11:49 PM - 12 July, 2006

Hi, unfortunately I am using a Mac and this program seems to be solely for PC use, is there anything else I can do to test my system?

867MHz Apple Powerbook G4 with 512Mb RAM
OS Tiger
Serato 1.5 (1536)

Dj KaGeN 11:51 PM - 12 July, 2006

uh, No. There seems to be more mac users on here than PC.
Ship it to me.. I make it work for you.

Zach S 11:08 PM - 13 July, 2006

icecoololly,

Ah yes, sorry.. I should have looked at your profile.
Can you email me your system profile?

To find this go to:
apple menu\about this mac\more info\file\save as

In the email also tell us what version of SSL your using (eventhough I know its 1.5(1536)).
What your USB buffer is set at and how often you get USB drop outs.

Email that information to zachs@rane.com
I'll forward it to the Serato developers who are trying to fix the USB drop out issue once and for all.

icecoololly 10:11 AM - 14 July, 2006

Ok zach, I have sent the info off.

Thanks for the help, I hope this will help sort it out in the future

Zach S 4:26 PM - 14 July, 2006

I got the info and uploaded it for the Serato developers to look at. Thanks for the help:)

Sam 6:51 AM - 18 July, 2006

Hi Icecoololly,

wow, that's some serious dropout action!

Is this something that happens often? Can you reproduce it? Do you have your Airport / Bluetooth / networking turned off?

icecoololly 4:16 PM - 22 July, 2006

One thing that i have found is related to my dropouts is that because my laptop is 3 years old, the power cable has a slightly loose connection. And what i did notice was that at times when i had dropouts I would see the green light on the power cord of a powerbook flickering between green and orange. This probably means that the connection was a little dodgy and I suppose the surges of power could have something to do with my dropouts.

That series of dropouts has only happened twice in 6 months or so, and it seems to be random and I dont think i could reproduce it. I shall try turning off my networking stuff. I have a wireless network at home so i guess that could cause interference. Although I do make sure i close all apps except serato and my audio recorder.

Zach S 6:41 PM - 24 July, 2006

People with drop out problems have had good results from using
www.driveragent.com.
Check it out. I think once you update your drivers your system will run much better.

Scratch Live Help