Because of this:

" feel like having Sync is actually a really good thing because without the hassle of beatmatching by ear you can have more room for creativity since you aren't having to use up precious time making sure two tracks are playing exactly the same."

It's been proven plenty of times that those who use sync (with the exception of A-Traktor) don't do anything more creative than without sync.

It's an illusion.

nm

@6 I gotta agree with you that there are people who cant do anything but call themselves DJs because they can hit a button, but on the other hand the possibilities that it creates could be pretty darn cool

COULD be is right! 6 hit this on on the head. It is easy to say this BUT I have seen my share of these very same people using SYNC for "creative reasons" sit back and let things go.
BTW was this A-Trak or Traktor? LOL Traktor was the software I first noticed this excuse with so I am guessing A-Trak.

I call A-Trak A-Traktor for obvious reasons. lol

nm

Im on year 5 of waiting for any DJ to show me a single thing that cant be done without the 10 secs it takes to beatmatch. If you cant do things because of beatmatching, learn to beatmatch faster.

By definition you have one less skill than other Djs. Also most DJs I see use it lack other skills usually learned while learning beatmatching.

Oh no!!! Isn't THIS the exact moment the four deck concept is presented??? LOL

Nope, 4 decks can be mixed by ear with skill, in fact thats WHY its impressive. 4 tracks automixed isnt impressive.

@Bezzle I see your point, but, instead of learning to do it faster, why not use the feature? When Serato came around, werent people glad to not have to carry around the heavy crates? Why not let the software take a little more of that trouble out? Plus, with the time saved you could find a new Ms Bezzle based on some fights between you and Joee on some thread

@deejdave elaborate? I don't understand what you're getting at

Because I actually enjoy DJing more than pushing a button and watching my laptop dj


There is no art or skill to carrying crates. If you think the basic skill of a dj is "trouble" to avoid, you may want to find a new hobby.

I know. Simply saying that this is typically the part in which it is brought up LOL.
IMO the human element gets lost with SYNC. In ableton it is called "Groove" where you try to get the track or sound to be less robotic and more human or live. DJing IMO should be live or Alive from the start. Even with all my SDJ Sheeeeit I still just do NOT use SYNC. Just my preference is all. I no longer dwell on it nor do I challenge it. As a matter of fact i accept that some use it. I just don't is all.

lol, I thought I was replying to the OP lol

Elaborate what? Using Four decks or many individuals who use SYNC do it for reasons of laziness instead of the claimed "creative opportunities"?

Disclaimer: This is an observation I have made on a personal experience level. I am in no way judging the world let alone any individuals I have NEVER met.

@Bezzle The references to crates came out a lil bit wrong: let me rephrase. Not having to lug the crates around made the logistics of DJing easier which I think could make the gig even more enjoyable since it was one less thing to worry about. I feel that used in the right form, Sync could do the same.
I think that all DJs should know how to beatmatch and I know how much more impressive doing it by ear is, but on a day to day gig basis, I see the value of having the extra tidbits of time not used beatmatching to add more creativity to the set. I guess it all just goes back to preference

@deejdave Great point. I think a DJ using sync to be lazy is inferior to a DJ that does everything by ear, so Id have to agree with you on that

Still waiting for an example. ...

Bpm read outs wave forms ... Why the fuck would u ever need sync when it's practically there already...

Sync .... The next best thing after wire hanger abortions

And this is the mission statement that all sync djs would copy and paste into all their debates when sync was introduced. It was a good time for the sync dj because it was the first time they had a good argument that was hard to dispute because if used properly it could actually be true.

But it would take a few years in all fairness to allow sync djs the required time to develope these creative sync skills...........

Fast forward years later and we can find no evidence of creativeness due to the time saved by sync. The ONLY documented cases of creative sync use that I've witnessed were by
DJ a track and dj craze who happen to be exceptional djs even without it.

So at this point in time I would have to agree that the claims that sync would improve creativity due to time saved is simply a fallacy.

@Bezzle Maybe it could provide you the extra amount of time to do let you throw in one more scratch, sample, or FX or something of that nature.

Beatmatching is not a logistical issue. It's a skill issue that used to be the biggest barrier to entry in the industry.

+1
While learning to beatmatch, up and coming djs would follow around more experienced djs and learn how to program a night, learn how and when to drop certain tracks, and other finer points that make a proper dj.


Like Bezzle has mentioned in a million other threads.... show me just "1" example of someone doing this. Still waiting...

......

......

Nope, sorry not buying it. If your set is so full of FX, samples, and scratching that putting one hand on a pitch fader for less than 5 seconds keeps you from doing something (dont forget you have a handy 2nd hand to mash out those samples and overuse FX) then your doing something wrong.

But please feel free to come up with or show a real world example. I really on the edge of my seat waiting.

I read a few posts, but this thread is just the same as every one before it.

"Sync good or bad"
"depends how it's used"
"well, it frees up time to do other things"
"learn properly and it's only a two second process"
"yeah, but you can do more if you don't have to deal with it anyway"
"show an example"
..................................

..............................

and yes, Bezzle has this covered.
You can argue you all you want...but until you can show someone that is actually doing something that actually REQUIRES sync to be possible (not just something that makes it easier)- you're trying to justify your laziness/unwillingness to learn a skill.

My biggest problem with these damn threads is that if the original poster didnt see something fundimentally wrong with it themselves they wouldnt be asking the question to begin with. If some controller kid talked shit about me using vinyl I wouldnt rush back to make a thread asking if im in the wrong for using it. Furthermore even if I did ASK FOR EVERYONES OPINION, I would listen and not try to argue my point once everyone told me why what I was doing was fucked.

Basically, if you think sync is so creatively epic, post a vid showing how awesome you are because of it and include some mind blowing shit that you cant do without it. If you cant do that then that answers your question.

Sync has its good and bad points BUT if your going to call your self a DJ then you should be able to beat match period (and do it well). The problem with technology like sync is that it allows anybody with a little $ to purchase minimal equipment, software and some music downloads to call them selves "DJs" and DJs they are not. I have been a professional Chef for the last 25 yrs. If a restaurant opened up where all the food was premade by some company and delivered to the restaurant where someone with NO or very little cooking experience could just heat it up and put it on a plate beautifully (a little extra time for garnishing maybe) wouldn't justify them calling them selves a CHEF. Maybe the customers wouldn't know and enjoy the food but anyone who actually put in the hrs to learn how to cook would. So I guess the real problem I have with sync has more to do with the people who don't know what they are doing just pushing buttons and calling them selves DJs. It waters down the art. It would better serve the art and DJ community if these people called them selfs SYNCERS and stop claiming to be DJS. YES I AM TALKING TO YOU PARIS HILTON. If you are a syncer then just say you are. Let the world know your not a DJ. Tell them that to be a DJ requires you to know how to do more than push buttons and then and only then would sync get some respect.

That... coupled with the other barriers: Access to turntables (and a mixer) as well as amassing a large enough record collection to actually craft a full set. All of that required a serious investment of time and money.

I don't think ANYONE would argue it has its uses. That is not really the point here. It is by no means needed. It SURE DOES make other things easier but this is pretty much because you no longer need to worry about the most important part of a blend. Everyone said it. I am saying it again. This is a tired and repeated post that has brought nothing new to the table.


DO what you do and IF this is what is needed for your success than by all means. The point will always remain DJ A did Set A. DJ B did Set B. They both used the SAME exact songs and mixed at the same exact times. ALSO using the same exact FX. DJ A used SYNC DJ B did NOT. Guess who's took more skill. Furthermore DJ A's (who used SYNC) ENTIRE set is now able to be duplicated by anyone with the same software being an algorithm was used to create it. DJ B's human element will be able to be closely attempted but NEVER repeated beat by beat.........................

LOL another thread with "the possibilities"

"The possibilities are endless!"

"Imagine the possibilities?"

"Think of the possibilities man!"

It's making me think of the ad execs on The Simpsons using buzz words.

These sync enthusiasts were sold strictly on "the possibilities" without actually knowing what these possibilities were.

Lisa: What is 'zazz'?
Lindsey Naegle: Zing! Zork! Kapowza! Call it what you want, in any language it spells mazuma in the bank!
Lisa: 'Zork'? What is 'zork'?
Lindsey Naegle: I didn't say 'zork'. The point is, think of the possibilities!



If you say it enough times they'll believe you.







I think this is one of the best points yet...

The problem with the sync Dj who can't be bothered to learn to beatmatch since "I don't have to learn, the button's right there for us to use, why not use it?", speaks for the mentality and work ethic they have when it comes to learning the craft they're supposed to be so passionate about.

If learning one of the most fundamental parts of this thing is too much, imagine when faced with learning the more advanced skills needed for these so called "possibilities"

They already can't be bothered, so as pdidy says, here we are years later and still nothing to show because they can't be bothered.






And there's the difference.




Look man, if you want to use sync, use it, but don't try and convince us when you're really just trying to convince yourself.

Your missing one very important key factor....syncs just not fun. Isnt it borring just standing there knowing your not doing anything, not challenging yourself, not keeping busy? Thats one of the reasons I stay on vinyl, the wow and flutter, gently rubbing your finger to slow it or twisting the spindle to speed it up juust a lil, it keeps you involved!

Not mentioned but not forgotten. I completely agree with you but I figured you had that point down. There is no sense of "connection" to the music when using SYNC. I will twll you one BIG difference I notice. Those who mix naturally use their entire body keeping the beat and getting into it. Those who use SYNC put on a show with their fists in the air, Air hearts & rockstar style headbanging.

I don't care much if people who know how to mix use sync. It really only bothers me when people that don't know how to mix use it.

Simple sync just basically matches BPMs which is what scratchlive users were doing by first matching the BPMs when they put on a new track.

If you think of it by using your eyes to sync the beat ticks that's a form of sync(cheating). Anything but, using your ears without knowing the BPMs, or using the screen is real mixing to older dj's like myself. Otherwise it's "assisted mixing".

I use sync on Traktor but, obviously can't use it on ScratchLive. It's important you don't start sounding like Grandmaster Jay calling this and that fake dj'ing but, sounding like ass you actually DJ.

Even with 4 decks, doing it without SYNC is just more fun.


Watchvimeo.com

nm

I was waiting for you to post that lol

I couldn't agree more with this. When I first started using a controller I thought using sync would allow me to get more creative, but as has been said before, there isn't really anything I can do with sync that I can't without it.

I have stopped using sync now and enjoy it far more. I feel more in control, and as Dave says, feel more connected .

But I do wonder this about those that say sync is cheating: do they use instant doubles, or manually load a track, match the tempo, and get in at the same time. Do they use auto loops etc, or manually loop a section of a track by using the same track on 2 decks. And so on.

The difference there is the only thing sync does is match the tempos of 2 tracks which can easily be learned and is 100% possible without sync. Whereas you can use the other things listed to do things that cant be done without them...for example I use auto loop to chop a beat down to a single note, drop a phaser over it, and use it as a wobble to mix any bpm into a dubstep track or create a on the fly build up. A) you cant do this with just vinyl B) Its ADDING to the performance whereas just letting the computer sync everything negated from what your doing.

I was thinking about back in the 90s when if your mixer had a 16bit sampler a whole world was opened up in my sets. The same feeling i had when I got an EFX500. A whole new world opened up me for FX and post fader echo, etc.

Not willing to knock sync unless the DJ doesn't know how to mix without it. I worry more about proliferation of controllers. I just have a hard time respecting them.

The slight changes in the blend as the DJ fixes the mix are heard (consciously or subconsciously) by the crowd, connecting them to the djs hands and mind and soul. Eventually no one will be left who even remembers that feeling. If you don't know what yer missing then you don't know what yer missing.

True. I meant one bar + loops which can be done on turntables.

but can you loop one bar to use it as an extended intro/outro and mix or blend it into another song in two turntables and a mixer

Also the fact remains even though these CAN be used to do things that are possible in vinyl, they still provide avenues to be creative that are not, I just gave exampled. The sync does not add anything ever.

seems like a no brainer to use sync if you never started without it.

i'm not good with it because, unlike traktor, i never really feel like SDJ is really all that tight unless i manually nudge it a bit anyway with dvs. Controllers would tighten it up, but i dont need it so i dont use it. could be helpful just for sheer speed mixing, but i think that paradigm, while still working in some places, is outdated.

Skateboarding vs riding a Segway.

Been waiting a long long loooonnngg time to see all the examples of brilliant stuff that "the time savings from using sync" has provided.... 10 years later, all we have is a parade of lame-tards invading DJ booths.

Some things are worth doing precisely because they're not easy to do.

Even if I fucked that quote up. lol

nm

Just to throw my own little pennies in here....I messed around with sync when Serato DJ was updated to be able to use with my 62 just to see how it works. Didn't really do anything for me and I turned it off in the settings. Today the feature is turned on solely for one use which is when I need/want to change the tempo of the song that would be almost or is impossible for me to do with the pitch on my Technics. I have used sync to be able to do live big tempos changes mostly for when I had to make specials mixes (hair show, dance competition, etc.)

Even still because I use Technics with Serato DJ it doesn't just stay on the wow and flutter is still there so I still have to at least to tiny adjustments just as normal. That being said I wouldn't even be using sync even for this reason if it wasn't for the Pitch N Time plugin that keeps the song from sounding crazy. Besides this I mix and blend records manually just like I've always have to me it's more fun and I'm actually doing something to me the whole fact of beatmatching and mixing is one of the main technical skills of DJing.

You can sound way better just straight mixing then "doing all the things because you have the free time" such as using effects, playing sound samples, etc. which is all "extras" that enhance or in some case cover the mix that your suppose to have the skill to execute.

I agree. (AIRHORN). When I watch other DJ's play (YOU'RE LISTENING TO DJ EFFECTS) and all I HEAR (HEAr HEar Hear) is effects, it makes me w-o-n-d-e-r-r-r-r-r-r if they even have any skill because I see them hit hit hit buttons hit buttons hit hit buttons buttons hit hit all night long but don't really see much actual skill. (AIRHORN)

nm

I see that someone else wanted a turn at lancing the dead whale...

Watchwww.youtube.com

True.

Sync: traktor dj forum
www.native-instruments.com

Surprised it would even come up over there. I use Traktor and all and it is a great program but that being said skill is one of the last things that is required to mix with Traktor........... or the others LOL. As many of them said and we can all agree this is a tired topic and you either feel one way or the other. One thing is undeniable though. The best DJ's are diverse DJ's and can use anything and run it well. Ask yourself one question. Lose your software and are you still a DJ?

Not trying to judge anyone but it just seems that clear to me.

LOL....good one, now let me go troll a few people with that line.....

god some of those traktor pro sync points are awful.

'The whole point of sync to me is to give back time to the DJ to allow them the chance to prevent boredom from kicking in. More time to read the crowd. More time to choose the next ideal track. More time to enhance the current track. More time to perfect the blend between the incoming & outgoing tracks. To get your eq levels right. Grab & drop a sample or acapella on a third or fourth deck. Use the remix decks to create a mash up on the fly.''

ummmm.....

thing about traktor is that it is made in Berlin, and big with techno guys(im no techno expert, but outside of detroit, berlin is probably the capitol for Techno((or at least thats the label, whether its currently deserved or not, thats not the argument)).

techno is all electronic, the records/song have their roots in mixing(2,3,4+) at a time to make new songs with the songs. It started with hardware sequencers and now is all quantized in DAW's or maybe still some drum machine sequencers, either way its quantized(which would be the production version of sync).

that being said, maybe its really not a big deal unless you are non techno dj?

I actually found a use for sync. With Simple sync on turntables, I can extend the pitch range of my turntable. Useful for extreme tempo blends - especially with pitch n time making it not sound like shit. So I can take a 90 bpm track and mix it with a 100 bpm track by centring the pitch on the slower track, hitting sync, and then pitch ride it how I want.

Mainly use it on acapellas and it's pretty useful.

Other than that though, yea, it's pretty pointless imo.

Same point I was making earlier you just made it more short and sweet to the point lol. Haven't really found any other reasons for sync especially for guys like me that play multiple genres. I would feel out of place not being able to properly pitch bend my tracks and just let them match up on their own. That's no fun at all and would make me feel lazy af.

When the CDJs first offered sync, I saw a vid with Laidback Luke doing some cool shit with 4 decks that would be physically impossible to do without sync unless you had 4 or 5 hands.... huge tempo change over 1 or 2 bars in the middle of a 4 deck blend (2 tracks, percussion loop, and a vocal loop I think), and then mixing in another track at the new tempo.

I've done big tempo changes in the middle of a blend before, riding both pitch faders then mixing in another track...pulling it off was an awesome feeling... but I'm not Goro behind the decks.
There's your one situation

That said, manually beatmatching is kinda like those magic eye pictures, where it's all abstract and then you cross your eyes and it's all fuzzy, but then all of a sudden the 2 images come together and it just pops off the page in 3D and you finally see it and realize that it's not a random pattern of triangles and you're like "holy shit, I see it! It's a fucking DRAGON!"
...yeah, kinda like that.

Think that SP6 is like Traktors Remix Decks...

All my 24 slots are filled with different beat-loops (dance, house, tech, hi hats, kicks, rides, basslines, etc, etc) and i'm using those with my mixes and with my songs. Sync is absolutely needed. That is how i play now and that is impossible to do without sync.
Also, i can put some acappellas perfectly on beat every time.
And, time is also important, when you have only 2 decks.

Beatgridding is the real work here...

IMO this is completly different than syncing 2 songs. Im 100% fine with sample syncing for remixing



this can be done without sync

true and beatmatching only takes a fraction of a second, you have plenty of time.

Sure, it can be doing by manually, but why bother when everything else goes with grids and sync.

Well, if you mean beatmatching by sliding the pitch, then yeah, it's "fast", but i'm talking about to put a new record (from the beginning or cue point) straight to the beat with volumefader up.
Then you don't have to hassle with pitch, headphones, nudging the record and wait till the beat is ok and the pull up the fader.


After 29 years of djing with manually, i just had enough and i move to the controller, beatgrids, SP6 and sync. Now i'm happy and i really don't want to go back to the cd-players or vinyl and manual beatmatching. It's just not my style anymore.

Offcourse, with some old songs, manual beatmatching is the right way to do it and thats ok for me... and i can still do it. :)

sounds boring

I think after 29 years you're just loosing fire and drive you used to have years ago so an EASY button is what you're now looking for.....hey it happens.

Certainly does not sound very appealing. I got the S8 and for all the hype I just can NOT seem to even consider using it without my TT's or CDJ's. It IS being done on a regular basis though. I have the X1 (MK1) as well and I use it for what I though it SHOULD be used for............... a SUB controller. IMO it is one of the best at that. What I do NOT get is how peope use the thing as the main controller with NO platters or even strip search.

yup

Quit then and find something else to do.

preach

The more controllers I use, the more I'm convinced that the X:one DX has/had the most precise manual pitch control known to man. Easily do increments of .01 (with an occasional skip to .02) with the incremental rotary pitch knob. Pushing the knob while turning increased that amount so you can (somewhat awkwardly) make larger pitch changes more quickly (but still nowhere nearly as quickly as a "traditional" slide-pitch).

I wish somebody would bring that back (maybe alongside the "regular" slide pitch)... It was waaaaay better than sync.

When I spin with vinyl I beatmatch, when I spin with digital tools I use sync. Why? I dunno... because it's an available feature? All of my music is BPM detected, so if I didn't use sync, what would I do? Pretend I can't see the BPM? It's silly. Get over yourselves.

Even though I have all of my tracks bpm'd and beat gridded, i still find sync to have some occasional hiccups. so i just stick to manual beat matching to play it safe.

Derailing this thread.

Tell me more about the faders in the S8. NI claims they are better without no real close up pics, schematics, or reviews from scratch nerds.

Hell ya! Thats why I just play other peoples mixtapes at gigs, I mean playing someone elses mix is an option right. I mean all of my music is BPM detected anyways so if I didnt play other peoples mixes what would I do? Pretend other people dont mix and dj myself?

Technically if you have ever played a Ted Smoove remix that's pretty much just a mix from another DJ. Just sayin'.

I will provide some up close pics tonight. They feel great though. That's all I will say for now.

LOL

"sounds boring"
Maybe for you, but not for me.

"I think after 29 years you're just loosing fire and drive you used to have years ago so an EASY button is what you're now looking for.....hey it happens."
Not at all. Like i said, i'm loving it every minute.

"Quit then and find something else to do."
Why? I love what i do.


Boys, let me do my job like i wanna do it...

I don't like your Input on this thread Pete :P

nm

Sounds like you don't want to do it at all.

Seriously, "After 29 years of djing with manually, I just had enough"

Enough of what, mixing? I could understand "after x amount of years, I can't take playing this pop bullshit anymore, so I switched up the kind of gigs I do"

But the mixing part is the physical motion, the part that got most of us interested in DJing to begin with, regardless of music choice.

It's like one of the things that can actually keep me sane on nights that "I've had enough" with the other shit that comes along with DJing. I can just bury my head in the movement of it all and tune everything else out.

I do like your Input. Paying attention Pete? :P

nm

Exactly, its the act of mixing that should cause you to strive to do better. If your bored, learn new techniques. be creative, come up with new routines to keep it exciting. Push the envelope, dont just make it even more borring

"If your bored, learn new techniques. be creative, come up with new routines to keep it exciting. Push the envelope, dont just make it even more boring."

That's what i'm just doing. Being creative. Making it even better. Pushing forward. Making better sounding mixes. Remixing on the fly. Making mashups on the fly and so on...

What i was bored, was the whole thing... Put the cd in. Make a cue-point. Beatmatch, blah blah blah. Every fucking time the same shit. And just "because" of the "cool factor", i.e. manual beatmatching. I have done that enough. Now i got beatgrids, multiple cue-points, SP6 with fully loaded beat-loops, pre-recorded loops, Flip and sync. All this is what i have been missing a long time. I remember when i was dreaming a setup like that in the 90's. Now it's reality and i like it. That's the way i have always wanting to work with.

I'm sorry guys that you don't understand my (new) way of playing, but that's your problem, not mine. I like it and that's the only thing that matters.

I'm not going to tell you either what you guys should do with your gear and how to play. That's your business and i respect that.

I guess my point is... you really can be creative with 2 decks and sync. It doesn't have to be basic A to B mixing.

Nope, the only thing your doing that cant be done without sync is the live remixing with loops which require more than 2 decks to begin with. I do live mashups all the time WITHOUT sync....

It sounds to me like you want to be a producer, not a dj. Why dont you just buy ableton and be done with it.

LOL I love this old one, apparently doing these things "on the fly" weren't possible before sync.




I'm sorry that your "new" way of playing is something most of us have already been doing for years, and was beyond your own understanding before you finally bought a new controller, but hey that's your problem, not ours.

; )

lol

nm

I use a variety of kit depending on the gig,laptop with x1,cdjs with memory sticks,laptop with timecode.

I personally do not like the idea of using a laptop,I just don't like the thing in the dj box,but I use it because its convenient,saves me burning cds or bringing cdjs,easy to organise tracks but boring as fuck to use.

I use sync on the x1, on the cdjs I don't.

I think the real relevance here and the thing that pisses me off the most and maybe some of you is that before sync I was know in my circle for my mixing skills (never missed a beat, well almost never)It was my thing,it took practise,it was like yeah I can do stuff that a lot of djs can't or won't learn.

Now my big point of difference has gone because with sync an average dj can sound as good as me more or less.

The other big point of difference was the music, I used to spend the money go to the right place and get the tracks that not everybody could get,now everybody can get their hands on the same shit.

Syncs here, use it or not makes no difference now,the bars lowered and its all fucked.
Think you're being a bit unfair beating Pete up for doing something he likes and enjoys more than the old days and that he feels is different to the norm.

TRUST for those who know the difference is there. As you mentioned it is "as good" but the thing is it is NOT. Is it perfect? Sure....................... it's designed to be. Yet this quantized algorithm sound is not the same. It is square and has "sharp corners" so to speak. If this makes any sense as I understand sound is not a tangible concept.


I say to each his own and I haven't personally sent any heat towards Pete. He has every right to do what he does without judgement. The thing is it certainly sounds boring and that is all I have been trying to say. I think it is the presentation more than anything as in the way his technique is being presented to us. It certainly sounds "off" then again who am I. He is in NO way obligated to impress me or anyone else here.

All I know is he is either being honest and so are we which is perfectly acceptable and expected in a public forum OR he is lying and being a troll and I DO NOT think it is the latter.

CAN but tend to NOT. One of the differences in a GREAT set is often the song selection. MANY times it is the new sound of music that is off the beaten path.

You must be new here; what you speak is blasphemous.

As a member of this board, one of your sworn duties is to tell others that they are supposed to play their music as manually as possible and chastise them for straying from tradition when they try to use "cheat aids". Djing isn't supposed to be fun; it's supposed to be work, and you are taking food from the mouths of -true- 4+ deck DJs with your antics.

Carl Cox may never get booked again because of you.

Yet the ones who don't use sync are the ones asking where the fun is, while syncers are making it out to be a chore. Sarcasm fail.

What sarcasm? It's a known fact that every DJ on earth derives pleasure from doing the exact same things the exact same ways, right?

Anyone who claims that sync is fun is clearly in denial.

The irony is there are...... or maybe were sync djs who believed in this fairy tail.

And probably just as many "Traditional" djs who believed it would true in a short time and were truly worried.....lol

I know you were originally just trolling but now you're struggling to make your own point and failing even harder by trying to switch up argument.

You missed with the "fun" comment, so now you're trying with the assimilation angle. Nice try ; )

Actually I'm just here to play with the festering whale entrails; it passes the time :).

Oh I know, I'm not new here, I'm just doing the same

;p

I don't think I've jumped into a sync conversation in a couple of years to be honest

It still amuses me on a primal level I guess.

I personally think sync has its uses but they're few and far between. 9 times out of ten it's more of a hassle than its worth just because turning it off is usually a 2-button process.

Does that mean I'm too lazy to sync?

Im thinking about getting a new laptop, should I get a mac or PC...what are your opinions

Lol

nm

SYNC definitely has it's place like anything else. But so far, it's place has never been....


"So I can be free to be more creative blah blah blah"

nm

Beatmatching is only ONE part of the whole equation. you still need to pick the right songs, know how to build a set, properly match levels/gain/key/tempo/rhythm, still have to use proper structure, read the crowd...sync is a tool at the end of the day. More and more features in dj technology are making the "means to an end" mentality much easier to achieve. I do not like sync, and have never used it...well...I don't have any tech that offers sync anyways...would you trust a pilot or driver who just knows how to use auto-pilot/auto-drive? Some people wouldn't give a shit. However, dj'ing has always been more of a technical art. Slowly technology is killing the art and more-so soul of dj'ing...mixing...Nothing is cornier to me that seeing a dj only press buttons...ie...almost every time a new product related to Serato DJ/Pioneer/DJ Techtools comes out.

Sure, but the difference is that while you take the time to learn how to beatmatch, you are inadvertently learning how to do all these other things.

If you take beatmatching out of the equation, you get djs that don't know or care about "pick the right songs, know how to build a set, properly match levels/gain/key/tempo/rhythm, still have to use proper structure, read the crowd". Come to think of it, a lack of those skills is how I would describe most new sync djs that need to bring their controller to a club equipped with CDJs/turntables and DJM mixer.

No such thing in terms of pilot LOL.

I am assuming when you say DJtechtools you are referring to the midi fighter's. YUP not much else going on there BUT button pushing!! LOL. What's cool though is MOST of the gear being released even down to the bottom tier (DDJ-SB, Wego, Reloop's as anything lower is not even DJ gear in my eyes) can usually be used in a similar manner to traditional DJing. The part I personally LOVE is as I mentioned earlier..................... you can 10000% tell who is really DJing and who is just boppin their head while button mashing.

IRKS me to see a controller sitting on TOP of a TT dust cover or RIGHT on top of a DJM mixer. Uhhhhh you FINALLY get a chance to get yout hands on REAL gear and THIS is how you handle it!?!?!?!? LMAO

LOL
I will never understand this. They have the opportunity to play on the same gear used by their hand-heart-making producer heroes, and they stick with their toy instead. That's the ultimate indication of reliance on sync.

ecactly!!

Agree with lots of what you are saying but my point is that the bar is now so low that 20 year old customers neither care or understand what the dj is doing same for most managers. To these people a dj is a dj and a mix is a mix and I doubt that many could tell the difference between a good dj and a bad one and that is the sad thing.

Agreed but this is why I try to rise above instead of cater to this.

Yup...agreeing on the "inadvertent education process" that occurs. The process of learning to beatmatch, usually with vinyl, gives you a real-feel and connection to the music. You control and can feel the tempo and heartbeat of the music. Simply just mixing two records correctly together has been way overlooked for the most part. And this is one of the most important part of mixing...Everyone is in a fucking rush to mix in/out, effects, button mashing, adding 3 and 4 decks into the mix, samples, loops, etc...it's becoming an absolute mess. The evolution of syncing is making it easier for this to occur. Syncing makes it alot easier to take the human element (soul) out of the mix. I have to say, over the past 25+ years of listening to mixes, I have always enjoyed hearing and listening to how dj's mix, blend, scratch etc...if you listen enough, you can tell different styles apart. Listening to synced up, over-digitized, mechanical mixes where a dj is trying to do too much in the mix is very over-bearing. Getting back to the the basics is always something you should never forget.

These new school, microwave, fucking autopilot douchebags are fucking up the game! Now the plane even takes off and lands for you! Most of them only ever performed an actual take-off or landing in a simulator.... I've even heard of this one pilot playing cards with his co-pilot the entire flight! Shit sounds boring! The whole thing takes the fun out of flying. I remember when I got into the game, how we worked hard on our skills! You can't replace the feeling of that first time you nailed that perfect approach! What happens if the gear fucks up and you actually have to fly the plane for real? If you never truly learned the fundamentals, you are going to planewreck and fuck up the night for everybody! Shit is WACK!

Even WHEN the plane is fully automated I am sure in training the Pilot learned how to fly LOL........................ regardless of they did on a current flight I am sure there was some schooling with proper hands-on training involved.

F-ing Drones just got officially classified as aircraft and will require mandatory training as well. The GVT. is even starting to keep a record of any/all who employ drones.

Yes and no.

No, i don't want to be a producer (in a traditional way), but i like the way where Traktor is going ("the future of djing").
Only problem is that i'm a Serato-fan and moving to the dark side is not appealing (except Kontrol S8 and Maschine Studio). :)

The next step for me would be midi clock and Maschine (or something similar) with Serato.
Some kind of mixer (like 8, 10, 12 or 16 channels) for the loops, samples and one-shots would be cool too. Like for drums, they could be also grouped to the 1 slider for quick access... something similar that Paul Kalkbrenner is doing with his mixer.
At this point, everything it's just under a thinking process and only time will tell.

Sure, but not the way i do it.

Been here since late 2010 or early 2011. So yes, i'm kind of new here.

If Carl Cox have problems with gigs because of me, then i don't know how to help him.

Thank you for understanding. :)

Sync has it's uses if you are a performance DJ or something. Think DJ Enferno, Shiftee, etc. But regular joe schmoes that are basically just mixing two tracks together, doing the occasional blend/mash up, I just can't see the appeal to it other then being lazy.

Your apathy is, like, destroying the art and what-not.

;)

So why don't you show us?

+1 im interested in seeing this

Sorry guys, i don't make any kind of videos at all. I don't have equipment to do that (except my smart phone) and i don't have any kind of experience to do, edit and share those either.
I have never uploaded anything, anywhere. Not even mix tapes.
So, if you want to see or hear me playing, you have to come to the club where i play.

One of my colleague once said to me that why don't you make videos of your playing and i said him the same thing, BUT If he ever want to help me to do some kind of video, then maybe, but not in the near future.

yes he does

serato.com

Say it with me everybody: excuses

nm

Also, tell us where you play. I'm sure one of the people here can make it happen - and record you at your gig.

nm

A smart phone is all you need. And theres nothing to edit, in fact editing defeats the purpose, just turn on record then upload to youtube.

Smart phones are killing cinematography. They've taken all the skill out of it. Mail us all copies on 8mm film :)