because?

if you want new features you have to pay the piper and honestly paying is the only way you will get good results. your not forced to upgrade, keep using the version you have it's not like it has bugs or anything right?

Serato are a software company, but they make their money through licensing their software to hardware manufacturers like Rane and the Itch controller makers.

Inklen are a software company, they sell software.

I have to pay to upgrade to each major version of Ableton Live. And Mac OSX. And Adobe CS. And Final Cut Pro. And Mixed In Key. And Traktor.

Point releases should be free, sure. Shouldn't have to pay for bug fixes. But major releases?

As long as I can pay a reasonable upgrade price, not full retail, I have no problem with that. I get paid nicely for what I do. Don't see why software makers shouldn't.

Where is this info? It isn't on the website...
And what are the new features for the paid upgrade from the current version?

Where did you get this info from?Not from me did you?

Cause heres the first thing I read...

as long as it works with scratchlive.

yea, where is the amount of the upgrade listed?

i have 1.0 and as long as it's not a ridiculous amount like another $179 i won't mind paying for an upgrade. the program has more than paid for itself. i am sure an upgrade even if it were a high price would be worth it too.
frankly, i am surprised that most new versions aren't all charged. most companies do charge for upgrades. people have gotten insanely spoiled by serato's lack of charging for new versions.

I love my ME, with that being said I wont pay over $50 for a update. Dont get me wrong I dont mind paying its the amount I might have a problem with. If the new upgrade offered Free visuals and Karoake support then I am willing to pay more.

pay for a upgrade lmao. wow

I don't mind paying upgrade fees for a good product. Especially a software, you get what you pay for. Free updates are great at first, but when the money isn't there to pay for the engineers, you start to see the effects. Less people, less work, more problems/bugs.

I would gladly pay a fee for bug free software, weather it be Scratch live, Ableton, ME, Video SL...etc.

Yeah exactly I don't mind paying.
Everyone has to pay adobe for cs3, cs4, cs5.5.
It's not like inklen makes money off of vinyl sales, it's solely ME sales. what if there we no new video djs and inklen only has revenue from last years ME sales, I'm sure this isn't the case as more and more people switch to video, but still I don't mind paying at all.

I'd rather pay and know I'm getting something worth it vs, here's a free update, it sucks, but hey it's free

here's an example of someone spoiled by serato.

so you've never paid for an upgrade? on windows? on mac os? a new phone? on anything?

this is a hint at the root of some problems.
maybe, just maybe if we paid for new versions of serato programs, the current ones would be a lot less buggy. wouldn't serato have greater pressure to do better work? wouldn't they have greater funds to create products? wouldn't more funding help a company?

look at the big picture instead of your wallet.

so maybe if we paid for ssl updates, like to 2.0, then it would be more stable?

or would it be psychological?

not bashing, just saying......based on Niro's comment.

anyways, if i do have to pay for an upgrade for anything, it better be working and worth it. in the meantime, i'll appreciate whatever free upgrades we get.

Im ok with paying for upgrades, and i have in the past and have no problem with doing so. But i am upset cause i bought ME within the last year. And that just seems a little unfair. Buying any software you should get any new versions that are released within the 1st year of ownership.

I'd rather pay (reasonably) for updates than have:

1) stagnated software development

2) unresolved bugs lingering through multiple versions.



Exactly.

But you don't, with any software that has paid upgrades. Maybe if you buy a month before or something.

Keep in mind that if you choose to upgrade (and it is a choice) then you'll be in at the .0 release of version 2. Version 1 has been around for what, 4 years?

So if that is the case again you'll get 5 years of free updates for the price of the software plus one upgrade fee.

Sounds reasonable to me.

Don't think there is anything psychological about bugs in the software, it's there and without the man power to figure it out, it's going to be there. Scratch live does not generate money on a regular basis. So after you've bought the product, they con't make anymore money from you. Yes it's good business sense to keep things going, because they still get new customers, but nothing like they did in the beginning. That is why Itch, intro was introduced and I believe where a lot of the resources went.

So would paid upgrade produce a better product. Yes, it only makes good business sense and security. I make a living off of DJing and would gladly pay someone to help me keep doing so. It's a symbiotic relationship, they produce stable good software and I DJ with that software.

Free is what it is free. If two parties are not benefitting, than eventually one will depart. You the customer will go to another product, the company will discontinue support. But if you the customer pays for upgrades (features that are more than what you initially paid for) and the company makes enough money to keep support than it's beneficial relationship.

So, yes I would gladly pay for upgrade fees, especially if it's offering me something that I want or need.

TRUTH!!!

although I do not mind free upgrades, if they charge, they charge thats business, You have the option not to upgrade if you feel the update"features " are not worth the extra cash

oh oh oh but vsl gives us free updates.....
honestly me and vsl should not be compared to eachother, the only things the have in common is the both play videos and use ssl, on feature and quality they are not even in the same country let alone ball park

Adobe only gives you 30 days, so a year seems a little far fetched, plus an adobe upgrade is 100's vs what ME might be.

if you're already registered with ME, you get 2.0 for free.

ME 2.1 will be when the original 1.x users have to pay, at a discounted price. how much discount and what the new price is? don't ask me....i wish i knew.

what Niro said!!

sigh

like if people spent their money for a video plug in from Serato instead of using their free demo to support another companies plug in that you spent that money on... maybe, just maybe we would have seen updates and VSL would have been better? You make a good point. ;)

I beg to differ.

Every video DJ I know bought VSL first and then got ME later.

VSL is the brand name with the advertising budget and press coverage.

People naturally gravitate towards that first, then buy ME when they reach the limits of VSL.

I'd bet anything until this last year when Serato really neglected VSL, at least 90% of Inklen's customers had a VSL licence already.

I bet me has to pay serato a license fee now, bet they came to some agreement. So me needs to boost there profits so charge for the upgrade also i noticed this is the answer you get from me if you ask... Will me work with itch? Not at the moment.... Do i guess serato could be letting me on itch maybe from version 2.1 and that will make me and serato some money. Just like pioneer, vestax, numark, denon ect pay serato so might me be now.

Would make alot of sence.

Again this is just what i have come up with i have no proof this is the case.

Speculation all over the board ;) Lets just see what happens. Im ready to pay to play. Doesnt bother me one bit.

Exactly.

And I was one of the many who bought VSL when it dropped back when everyone's video edits looked like ass and there were only a few video dj's

maybe, but just maybe not too.

same.

I would agree with you but since most of my problems (corrupted videos and tags) have been caused by the Scratchlive side of things I can't.

yup.

um. you dont need the video sl plugin to make ME work. just making sure yo got your facts straight.

And I among plenty of ME user's also own VSL, partially because I owned a pc when I started using video and realized that Video was never going to work up to the standards i expected it to (the quality level of VDJ), and I was dumb and didnt look hard enough before purchasing. So once i realized that ME was the way to go to get stable performance and acceptable level of features and updates, and a good midi mapping system. I bought a mac and moved over to ME. Serato, up until now shot themselves in foot by not updating and supporting VSL to its fullist potential. I for one am excited to see what Serato video brings. but Serato themselves even said Serato video is just a platform for future upgrades. So i wont be hold my breath for amazing features out of Serato video or expecting i will be switching over anytime soon.

Sersto Video is Just VSL with a new name. you ave to pay for it & it's being released so an internal switch can be clicked so itch will allow it as a plug in. No new effects or transitions

HAPPY HUNTING

haha... you don't have to beg to differ with me, I still respect you and your opinion. It's just different sides of the same coin.

>>>>>FROM THE ME MANUAL>>>>>Controlling MixEmergency from Scratch Live is as easy as loading videos in Scratch Live,....
Note: To import videos into your Scratch Live library you need to download and install the demo version of Video-SL and check "enable Video-SL plugin" in the plugins tab of Scratch Live's setup screen.


Well, if you want to actually control it with SSL you seem to need it... and even if that changes, you have needed it for most of the time the plug in has been out so..... I guess you are the one guy who actually uses it as a stand alone program and does not use scratch live with ME at all? Impressive. Good for you!

Haha, this turned into another ME vs VSL thread.

and if the had all the money that went to ME, maybe the could have invested that into more development and we wouldn't have had those issues? No?
I really wasn't even being that serious. Relax everybody. But seriously... you don't see how more money could = more development which could lead to less problems? You honestly don't get that?

I was just messin with y'all RELAX hahaha

That manual is old now. Things have changed. You DO NOT need to have Vsl installed to use ME anymore. as long as you run serato 2.3.3. or higher.

ok so for the majority of it's life, you used it with out SSL? Really? So since it's been like that for a short amount of time you honestly can't see any kind of a point here at all?
Again.. relax

It's all good, just funny.

I can see both sides and it also makes sense from both sides, so I'm staying out of that discussion.

But, I'm more than willing to pay for upgrades to any program I use, if it ensures a more stable and better program. Weather it be Adobe, Serato, VSL, ME, Final Cut....

Right?!

smart move. It was late and I just felt like throwing down some firecrackers and watching people start dancing. hahaha It really wasn't that serious.


right

Some of us paid for Vista and look what we got....

Sometimes you get screwed, I met a few dudes in Thailand that paid for a women and look what they got.... haha, I can go into my rant about consumers voting with their money.... but whatever. I'd rather go watch Spartacus on Netfix, smells like Budussy!

Oh Big Wiz, good job on the Skratchworx 61-62 explanation video.

hahahaha


Thanks

Ill just in with some info here....

Mix Emergency has ZERO to do with the ability to run without VDJ enabled/installed.

When SSL dropped 2.3.3 they added this: (memory fading... 99% sure it was 2.3.3):
you no longer need to install the VSL demo, nor the purchased version of VSL for SSL to
read and playback mp4 files with SSL live.

I ran into this when I would do a remix, and an audio guy would want to spin it.
Id send him my mp4 video file, and SSL wouldnt read it.
they they would just go and download the free demo of VSL and that would open up
SSL's ability to use the audio aspect of the MP4 in your audio library.

now, by default SERATO has decided to make that a native feature.



<> yeah...very well done on those vids man.
you know how much its killing me that I might not be able to get a 62 :(

I assume you when you wrote VDJ you ment to write VSL

yeah... thanks....

I did a 4 DVS comparison video last night for video systems.. took 4 hours.

needless to say all these abbreviations have become muddled.

and composite and component and now the same in my head.
#rattled

which 4?

VSL/ME/VDJ/MV

Man where is that Eddie Griffith Popcorn eating clip when you need it?

cache.blippitt.com

+1

Thank you sir

hahaha

2.0 upgrade will be free. 2.1 and above will require an upgrade fee. i have no problem paying for a 2.1 update. ME has more than paid for itself.

So I can run M.E without even starting up serato to do video mixing. Ok so ME is go charge to do upgrades so he can stay above water. But ya'll wont support serato. Wow. Some how I new it was go come to them charging. Hell others wanted a new mixer and we got 2 now people are crying its 2 high. Well I will be getting one and if u cant afford it buy a used 57 .

^^ dude, what are talking about.

no clue. the 62 is too damn high or me is too low.

LMFAO (not the band) ;-)

Yes i do it all the time when im running the light that the club i work at. Just load up a bunch of quartz files into the media bank, set up some text and image overlays and and run visuals for the audio only DJ's.

I never should have started this thread.... My bad. Sorry Nick.

yep, it's quite a nice feature. i've gotten paid just to do that.

seems smart people like Code E & tomatoslice know. lmao

i hope that's not sarcasm, I dont think it is but either way i ignore sarcasm on principal.

You're blinded by your VSL fanboy-ness. Point is, we already all supported Serato and bought VSL... when it became stagnant, we all switched to ME.

Your fighting a uphill battle and with the announcement of Serato Video... I sure he and the other few who waited will walk around with their chest stuck out now... If ME wants a fee for a update then it'll be well worth it. Oh and there is a free update about to drop soon that'll send Video SL or Serato Video or whatever they want to call it now back to the drawing board... Good luck with the new update guys.. you've waited around and stuck it out and I truly hope it's well worth the wait... No BS.. I'll be glad to see what they come up with next

that's cuz i am always right. when i am wrong it's usually cuz i thought i wasn't right.

hahahaha

+1

the 62 is a dreamboat,
the more and more I look at it, the more videos I watch....the more i want it!

I have no problem paying for ANYTHING that's gonna allow my creative juices to flow (NH)

+1

ooops, hit enter.

a majority of post DVS users (not all), but a vast amount are soooo against paying for anything.

I personally know a handful of DJs who are PROUD that they havent paid for ANYTHING in years... yet, they are the FIRST to cry about undercutters.
we all know an Ideal business model is to limit spending & boost profits.

and while it seems top tier mobile guys REALLY "seem" to understand the importance
of proper spending, vs frivolous spending...
meaning, these huge corporate events, they will run mulitple back ups, have no pirated anything, laptops JUST for spinning...
but not their headphones arent bedazzled, or their laptops dont have crazy skins.
or their mixers dont.
(Im soooooo guilty of that..)
they spend their money where they KNOW that its a solid benefit to their package.

so, a new mixer drops.
sure the price is a little higher.... but as my dad used to say: "if you wanna dance, you have to pay the fiddler"
if I want all the bells and whistles of an already established mixer brand I better be prepared to shovel over some dough.

but that goes for alot of things.... and I think thats the dis-connect we see now with alot of people who didnt blow their money on black crack every week at the record shops.

you cannot expect everything for free.
and if you do... dont expect to get the creme de la creme.... your going to get what you need
to get by...its not like we get paid in vegatables and livestock.
if your the kinda of person that warrants a 1500 mixer and equipment for your performance... then you should
be charging accordingly....if you dont, thats on you.

I can never be on the side of "everything should be free, or waaaah thats too expensive"
(within reason)...theres only "I dont wanna pay for anything, or Waah that's too expensive FOR ME!"

That's EXACTlY what I said when Allen & Heath dropped the v6!!!!!

hmm...so are they the 99% of the dvs world?

i.qkme.me

I agree with everything you said but this.
Its really hard in some markets to charge a reasonable rate.I cant, and it sucks but 30 min drive to the next city (which is smaller by half) i can make triple. I own all top end gear, and use it all to its fullest potential. But it making that money back is gonna take years. :(
In club that hits capacity at 500ppl and fills up every weekend what do you guys think is a fair rate? club opens 930-2am. and i do video.

I feel ya.
but thats sort of a"thanks to the dooshbags" situation.

I am dealing with the same exact thing now.
they have a spot; they really really enjoy what I do, they love video.
I committed to them 1 Saturday a month @ 450.00 for 9-130am

the room holds about 400, 2nd room holds 300, then they have 3 other rooms that hold 500+
between the 3 others.

so, they get a little slow,
panic.
cut promotions.
cut the DJs who kept folks there...
bring in local promoters.....
6 months later.

what would it take for you to come back every other week.
I say, same rate... i wont rape u guys for bailing at first sign of slowness...
we'll... the last crop of djs only got 200 a night....
yeah, howd that work out for ya?
and on come the billion of excuses why the old rate is no good.
I just said, thanks but no thanks.... I cant LOOSE money to come to your club.
"but the club isnt in the city.... we cant pay the same"
I know, you should pay more..I can make it to the city in 10 minutes...
I got an hour each way to get to your club... thats $30.00 in gas alone!

we all know, its a familiar story.... and it sucks....

theres a formula somewhere where you put the cover charge + drink prices + % full
and these numbers in it... and it spits out a fair dj rate.
But I think we'd all agree that for 500 people, with no gear doing video weekly (Not a guest spot) would be 300-550 a shift

i get half that low number. I have been at this club on and off for 7 years and im the highest paid DJ on payroll. This city's club owners are just checked and dont understand the value of a DJ. They say to me all the time we dont care how skilled you are or anybody else, they all only want you for your promotional value, how many facebook posts you do abou thtere club, how many tweets you tag there club in, and how many people come out to see you regularlly that buy tables. And did i make it clear they dont care about the DJ skill. they dont understand that it makes them look bad by having shitty music being played. All they want todo is hear you on the mic, play games with people, pump up there other parties on the mic, and lastly play some music.

Oh and i play every single saturday night, in there main room fitting 400 people. And over the last 7 years i have always had at least 1 night a week residency (up until recently 3 nights) at one of the 2 big clubs (which are on the same street same block and show about 3 years in the middel of that 7 where under the same owner).

Its funny that you guys are talking about this. Did anyone catch "True Life" on MTV with that guy wanting to be a DJ?

He played for $100... ended getting jipped and they only payed hime $30 lol.

It's cause there's other cheap bastards out there who will do it for $100.