DJing Discussion

This area is for discussion about DJing in general. Please remember the community rules when posting and try to be polite and inclusive.

Who Invented The Technology?

dbandit 6:42 PM - 16 January, 2006
I know this might be a stupid question but I like information. I was thinking the other day...I wonder who came up with the technology for SSL and FS. I know it's based on time sequence like what they've used in studios to sync 24 track tape. But I wanted to know who came up with the idea to apply it to records and mp3s etc. Just so I could know what to say when people ask...does anyone on here know?

Bandit
hologram 6:49 PM - 16 January, 2006
I first heard of a system like this from BPM studio A few years before FS bUt I don't Know for sure. One thing si Serato/Rane is the one who got it right ;)
Konix 7:47 PM - 16 January, 2006
A Dutch company named N2IT made the first FS. If you want a somewhat better explaination of how the idea came to be, watch this video of John Acquaviva from 2002 at the Red Bull Music Acadmey, talking about FS and the idea behind it...

www.redbullmusicacademy.com
panchito 11:21 PM - 16 January, 2006
who cares SSL mastered it :)
Konix 11:27 PM - 16 January, 2006
Quote:
who cares SSL mastered it :)


Exactly! :)
Revolutionary 11:30 PM - 16 January, 2006
Some history from my man Josh
Quote:
To put in perspective how much effort has gone into our product, Steve W therorised the exact method we used to operate Scratch Studio Edition, back in *1995*. Yes, almost 10 years ago.

Those same records were used for the initial builds of Scratch LIVE until the amazing noisemap technology with it's great advantages was proposed. Scratch LIVE was already well on the way in terms of initial theory work _years_ before FS debuted at any tradeshow.

After teaming up with AJ, the two spent the intervening time building Serato into a world beating plug-in developer, Pitch 'n Time is used daily on blockbuster movies and platinum selling albums the world over, and is still after 5 years on the market the single best regarded plug-in of it's type, let alone one of the most expensive you can buy for Pro Tools.

We didn't see a demo of FS and say "hey we could do that" we already knew it, and had tested ideas well before then.

That's how we made this the bomb-ass product it is! Time, scientific investigation, and loads of work. No biting necessary.
punosion 1:23 AM - 17 January, 2006
Nice!

Anything to read-up on how the code works? I heard rumors of a white paper.

So if you have the L and R plugged-in opposite, the record plays in reverse...so obviously the record has a signal that's unique playing forward, which is then reversed for the other channel. That's about all I know and probably all I need to know. ;)
hologram 1:55 AM - 17 January, 2006
Quote:
Nice!

Anything to read-up on how the code works? I heard rumors of a white paper.

So if you have the L and R plugged-in opposite, the record plays in reverse...so obviously the record has a signal that's unique playing forward, which is then reversed for the other channel. That's about all I know and probably all I need to know. ;)


AH HA!

So that's why when you loose one channel in your Orts, (Old time Ortofon users know what I mean.. painfully) the playback stutters if you mess with the vinyl. I thought the signal was the same on both channels.
punosion 3:32 AM - 17 January, 2006
Technically, in a way it is the same signal...one channel has to be the same audio as the other, just reversed for the whole 10 or 15 minutes. Does Serato read the pitch and phasing between the two waves or what? This is what I don't get. Another thing...how does the track change signal work?

However it works, it's a friggin' marvel of technology and a blessing upon us DJ's. I love technology. ;)
mexicannnnnn 4:53 AM - 17 January, 2006
Here's some history of how ms pinky came to be:
mspinky.com
dbandit 2:09 PM - 17 January, 2006
Thanks Revo, Mexicann and others...much appreciated!
punosion 10:46 PM - 16 February, 2006
Thought I'd bump this and cross-reference a fantastic thread I ran across with a bunch of random tidbits on how SSL functions...here's a great post by AJ:

scratchlive.net

Quote:
It is quite misleading the way latency is listed on the comparison. The comparison is obviously talking about the internal delay before the system works out its absolute position after a needle drop. However this does not take into account the other delays inherent in the system like buffering, bus transmission and even digital conversion.

When you create a system for tracking absolute position on the disc, you have to make a tradeoff between reliability (through redundancy) and decoding time (through compactness). We went one way, and FS went the other way. Our control signal takes much longer to decode after a needle drop, but it is so robust and clear that you can decode it at any speed in any direction, and also it is no subtle compared with the directional carrier signal, that it does not destroy the all-important speed detection part, which is where frequency distortion comes from.

The FS timecode has compressed twice as many bits per cycle into the carrier, and the bits are at least twice as loud as the SL NoiseMap, however this compactness comes at the cost of smoothness and reliability at changing speeds.

In essence, the main difference between the two systems is that FS cares more about working out where the needle was dropped as fast as possible with little regard for how good it sounds, and SL cares more about staying locked to the movement of the record with little regard to how long it takes to work out where the needle was dropped.

We still think that this is the best way to go, because as long as the system can work out where you needle-dropped within say a 20th of a second, who cares how long it takes? On the other hand the quality of the sound and the fidelity of the scratching movements are so crucial, that sacrificing them just to speed up needled dropping seems crazy to us.
lesterdiamond 11:13 PM - 16 February, 2006
Quote:
I first heard of a system like this from BPM studio A few years before FS bUt I don't Know for sure. One thing si Serato/Rane is the one who got it right ;)


they got the software right not the technology, i love serato:)
s42000 11:25 PM - 16 February, 2006
I'm just glad that it works ... and spot (my dog) agrees.
punosion 11:47 PM - 16 February, 2006
Quote:
I'm just glad that it works ... and spot (my dog) agrees.


But he might not agree with the sound of the timecode coming right off the needles... ;)
s42000 12:18 AM - 17 February, 2006
mmmhh

'noisemap.....' he likes it, and yes he did not like the sound of 'timecode' when I had FS .. ;}
punosion 9:12 PM - 17 February, 2006
Now I'm curious...can you give me an idea of how the FS records sound?
s42000 9:18 PM - 17 February, 2006
They sound somewhat similar to me .... a tone.
But obviously the data is not stuff mere mortals were meant to understand.
nik39 10:05 PM - 17 February, 2006
Sounds like Beeeeeeezzzzzbeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzebbzzzzeeebzbzbbbbzzzzzz, but only if you have abused your records for quite a while :)
djgmhustle 9:26 AM - 26 September, 2016
RZA invented it
d:raf 6:22 AM - 28 September, 2016
Quote:
RZA invented it


^Truf

Watchwww.youtube.com
kip 5:24 AM - 30 September, 2016