You should change the levels on the phone input in the setup screen. Depending on which cartridges you are using. Also Rane mixers have truer sound output, where pioneer seems to amp up their outputs. You should compare them at the same DB level.

I think you must have the settings wrong.

You sure you have the input selector switch set to phono, that its grounded correctly and that you have the phono sensitivity setup correctly within SL.

The sound quality on Rane mixers is VERY good.

Sounds like your used to a crappy sounding 909 and not a clean sounding 62......?

My guess is you haven't changed the phono/line switch on the back of the mixer to phono or you need to raise the phono input sensitivity in the Hardware tab of the Scratch Live Setup screen to get a hotter output as Nero pointed out.

Nope checked the back of the mixer and all switches are correct. Hooked everything up to my Crown Amps through XLR cables and still the same thing.

Double checked the sensitivity in the software and left them at 5.0 mV since the lower settings became distorted.

The only way for me to accurately check dB levels between mixers is to RTA the output of the speakers.

But at similar perceived volumes the Pioneer still sounds more clear. It does seem like the Pioneer does provide more amplification than the Rane.

What kind of needles are you using?

if you have Shure m447 needles, you need the sensitivity at 9.5mV.

Vinyl tracks sound pretty awesome on my set up. However, it does sound warmer on vinyl compared to mp3s. But thats the nature of DVS vs vinyl.

I do wanna add that the 62 sounds amazing on larger upscale systems.

I'll change the sensitivity to 9.5 mV and check it out.

Regardless of the system the 909 sounds cleaner on my setup right now. And for my direct needs, the mixer has to be clean on my Hi-Fi system because that is where I listen to my jazz records and such. So the mixer has to be able to provide clean sound without a full sound board and eq's in a large club environment.

As a sanity check I had my fiance come in and listen to the same record through both mixers. She is NOT an audio person whatsoever and she said that the sound difference was very apparent between the two mixers. So I don't think it's just me being hyper critical of the Rane 62.

Now on a side note I just fell in love with the Rane 62 last night.

1. Way better in ear monitoring vs the pioneer. I can now fully enjoy mixing in headphone only at home with the same benefits as mixing with a monitor. The way the cues are set up in the Rane is just genius absolutely genius.
2. The Midi Layers I mapped last night have really opened the mixer. Loops on the second layer, DJ-FX on the third layer, coupled with my dicer for fun loop roll juggling and this is a crazy setup for fun sets.
3. The effects time sync really makes the a difference vs the Pioneer 909.

Like I said about, compare the two mixers at the same db level. In my experience a Rane mixer, especially a signal coming out of the RCA's will not be as hot as it is from a Pioneer mixer. So you can't compare with both mixer's master volume at the same level. Also Rane's will have a warmer more natural sound compared to the pioneer which has a little more tinny digital sound. So if you're system is EQed for a pioneer mixer, you might have to adjust it a bit.

The new Rane mixers output's have been changed and as long as you keep your program LED's from hitting the red, you can turn up the master to 10 and they's no distortion. I'm not sure if it was intentional or if they are heavy in the consumer electronics business, but they've fooled a lot of people by amp/having a hotter output signal.

Good luck

I just tested this using a 909 we have here.
I'm using the Serato Ortophon needles which also have a very high output.
I did have to turn up the phono sensitivity in Scratch Live to 2.5v to get the same levels out of them that I was getting when using them with regular vinyl and the 909 but after that adjustment the volume levels between both mixers, when played with the hottest audio without clipping the signal both on the input and the output, are virtually the same.
The 909 may have a wee bit more output but as far as sound quality I would give it up to the 62. The 909 has quite a bit of noise coming out of it when the proper levels are set on the mixer. 62 has virtually no noise.

Thanks for the update Zach I'm really impressed you setup the 909 to check for yourself.

Zach are you testing at the hottest levels between the 2 mixers for maximum sound output?

I'm not getting a hiss, but I'm not testing the pioneer at close to clipping levels either.

Yea if I can make the Rane sound better than my 909 I would love to sell the 909 for the cash. It's the only reason I'm keeping it at the moment.

Customer service is one of the main reasons to go with a Rane product! I'm happy to help:)


Yes.

Any audio from a mixer should be ran at the hottest levels without clipping the signal.
This will give you the best signal to noise ratio and provide you with the best sounding audio possible.
Read more about that here --> www.rane.com

When using the 909 I was able to set my input level (gain for the channel on the mixer) to a little past 12 o'clock without clipping the input.
I then was able to turn up the master level pot all most all the way without clipping the signal. If it was all the way up the LED when metering the master output was barely hitting the red.

On the Sixty-Two, after turning up the phono sensitivity to 2.5v, I was able to turn up the gain knob on the channel (ch. 1) to just under 11 o'clock without clipping the incoming signal.
From there, I set the master output to the Max.

As Nero said, the master output works differently on Rane mixers vs. Pioneer.
Think of the master level pot as an attenuator like the one you would find on the back of the Pioneer 600-900 (I think the 900 has it?). If you want to get the maximum output level you would turn this master volume knob all the way up. Turning up the master level knob on the 62 will not clip the signal like it would on the 909.
What you'll see on the master LED meter on the 62 is all the signals (channels) on the 62 being summed. This gives you a true level meter regarding what is being sent out.

The 909's master level meter is determined by the master output knob... not by what is being summed or mixed.

With these setting on both mixers I was able to turn down the speakers connected to the XLR outputs which gives you a better signal to noise ratio and optimized audio.

Try it out. I think you'll find that both mixers have an extremely hot output but the 62 has virtually no crosstalk (noise) being send out to the speakers. The 909 has quite a bit. Let me know if you have any questions:)

the biggest diffrence between the sound of these mixers is the Rane 62 is digital, and the Pioneer 909 is analog.

The Rane is a very clean sounding mixer, maybe djslik prefers to have some analog noise/distortion with his vinyl.

if that is the case he may do well buying an external phono pre-amp. try the phono pre-amp going clean into your home reciver, also try it goign into line inputs of your rane and pioneer mixers and see what sounds best to you. your ears don't lie.

Wow this is seriously the best tech support I've ever had. I really appreciate the technical feedback on this issue.

Thanks to everyone's input as well.

After much consideration I'm going to go ahead and sell the 909.

I have spent a couple of hours reading up on a couple of audiophile type forums and I can apparently get a high end phono preamp that is RIAA equialized for under $100 that will probably out perform both of my mixers in regards to sound quality and reproduction for music listening only.

Just for so you guys can see what I'm talking about here is a video of both mixers being tested today.

youtu.be

The saxophone at the very end of the video illustrates some of the clarity differences between the two mixers. I have tried my best to have both mixer outputs set as close to each other as possible.

Listening through laptop, that didn't even sound like the same record. I had to rewind to realize that the sax solo was playing on the 62

At the end of the day the Rane is still an amazing mixer. I don't think people really buy either the DJM-909 or the Rane 62 to sit and listen to vinyl.

Most audiophile types probably wouldn't even consider these as audiophile Phono Pre-Amps.

So I'm ordering an ART Electronics DJ PRE II Phono Preamp for $40.00. I might post another sound comparison once I get that in.

You're not playing one channel (e.g. left) of the record out through the Pioneer mixer, and the other channel (e.g. right) out through the Rane mixer are you?

It sounds like either that is the case, or perhaps there is some dodgy-connection/signal-summing/something-else going on.

That's EXACTLY what it sounds like

For the video test I have a single XLR out from each mixer going into my Crown XTi-2000 using CH1 + CH2 option.

I also tested both mixers with both XLR's to the same amp and had very similar audible results.

I have 2 Crown amps but one is a Crown XTi-2000 and the other is a Crown XTi-1000. I could rerun the setup that way to check again.

I'm not sure, the Rane sounds like it's bringing all of the instruments up front, the pioneer sounds like it just brings the sax up. If you really want to know, you should get a digital of the record and then compare which one sounds the closest.

" I'll change the sensitivity to 9.5 mV and check it out. "

Is this also possible on the SL2? Where can I find it if so?

Thanks a lot for helping!

Can anybody help me. I have a rane 61 with two pioneer plx 1000 turntables. Wanted to know do I need to change any setting on the mixer or anything for me to play real vinyl?

Phono channel if it's just on the mixer....
If you use it w Serato, make sure you switch internally to 'thru'...
c.

I want to use just my mixer and turntables no computer

Ehm....
Turntable RCA -> mixer phono in
Turntable Earth wire-> mixer earth
Mixer RCA line out -> amp/speakers line in.

Pretty straight forward that.
c.

We are officially in a new age

Not sure why SL2 kept getting mentioned.

Could be different RIAA equalizations.

Could be Rane phono pre getting overloaded by the Shure.

Could be a compressor/limiter crushing the signal on the Rane.

Or could be something else.

Oh, or input loading capacitance differences on the phono pres, even.