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Joseph Stack suicide letter (guy who crashed into building today)

djskiggz 10:52 PM - 18 February, 2010
Some of us been talking about government, corruption, etc, a lot lately, thought maybe some of you might be interested in reading it. It's a huge letter i know, but interesting to read. I'm not advocating what he did, but some of his point's about the complex laws and corruption are sooooo true. I bet his story is similiar to people out there who have almost lost hope. This guy just gave up. Thoughts?

Quote:
If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?” The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time. The writing process, started many months ago, was intended to be therapy in the face of the looming realization that there isn’t enough therapy in the world that can fix what is really broken. Needless to say, this rant could fill volumes with example after example if I would let it. I find the process of writing it frustrating, tedious, and probably pointless… especially given my gross inability to gracefully articulate my thoughts in light of the storm raging in my head. Exactly what is therapeutic about that I’m not sure, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

We are all taught as children that without laws there would be no society, only anarchy. Sadly, starting at early ages we in this country have been brainwashed to believe that, in return for our dedication and service, our government stands for justice for all. We are further brainwashed to believe that there is freedom in this place, and that we should be ready to lay our lives down for the noble principals represented by its founding fathers. Remember? One of these was “no taxation without representation”. I have spent the total years of my adulthood unlearning that crap from only a few years of my childhood. These days anyone who really stands up for that principal is promptly labeled a “crackpot”, traitor and worse.

While very few working people would say they haven’t had their fair share of taxes (as can I), in my lifetime I can say with a great degree of certainty that there has never been a politician cast a vote on any matter with the likes of me or my interests in mind. Nor, for that matter, are they the least bit interested in me or anything I have to say.

Why is it that a handful of thugs and plunderers can commit unthinkable atrocities (and in the case of the GM executives, for scores of years) and when it’s time for their gravy train to crash under the weight of their gluttony and overwhelming stupidity, the force of the full federal government has no difficulty coming to their aid within days if not hours? Yet at the same time, the joke we call the American medical system, including the drug and insurance companies, are murdering tens of thousands of people a year and stealing from the corpses and victims they cripple, and this country’s leaders don’t see this as important as bailing out a few of their vile, rich cronies. Yet, the political “representatives” (thieves, liars, and self-serving scumbags is far more accurate) have endless time to sit around for year after year and debate the state of the “terrible health care problem”. It’s clear they see no crisis as long as the dead people don’t get in the way of their corporate profits rolling in.

And justice? You’ve got to be kidding!

How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand. Yet, it mercilessly “holds accountable” its victims, claiming that they’re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand. The law “requires” a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if that’s not “duress” than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is.

How did I get here?

My introduction to the real American nightmare starts back in the early ‘80s. Unfortunately after more than 16 years of school, somewhere along the line I picked up the absurd, pompous notion that I could read and understand plain English. Some friends introduced me to a group of people who were having ‘tax code’ readings and discussions. In particular, zeroed in on a section relating to the wonderful “exemptions” that make institutions like the vulgar, corrupt Catholic Church so incredibly wealthy. We carefully studied the law (with the help of some of the “best”, high-paid, experienced tax lawyers in the business), and then began to do exactly what the “big boys” were doing (except that we weren’t steeling from our congregation or lying to the government about our massive profits in the name of God). We took a great deal of care to make it all visible, following all of the rules, exactly the way the law said it was to be done.

The intent of this exercise and our efforts was to bring about a much-needed re-evaluation of the laws that allow the monsters of organized religion to make such a mockery of people who earn an honest living. However, this is where I learned that there are two “interpretations” for every law; one for the very rich, and one for the rest of us… Oh, and the monsters are the very ones making and enforcing the laws; the inquisition is still alive and well today in this country.

That little lesson in patriotism cost me $40,000+, 10 years of my life, and set my retirement plans back to 0. It made me realize for the first time that I live in a country with an ideology that is based on a total and complete lie. It also made me realize, not only how naive I had been, but also the incredible stupidity of the American public; that they buy, hook, line, and sinker, the crap about their “freedom”… and that they continue to do so with eyes closed in the face of overwhelming evidence and all that keeps happening in front of them.

Before even having to make a shaky recovery from the sting of the first lesson on what justice really means in this country (around 1984 after making my way through engineering school and still another five years of “paying my dues”), I felt I finally had to take a chance of launching my dream of becoming an independent engineer.

On the subjects of engineers and dreams of independence, I should digress somewhat to say that I’m sure that I inherited the fascination for creative problem solving from my father. I realized this at a very young age.

The significance of independence, however, came much later during my early years of college; at the age of 18 or 19 when I was living on my own as student in an apartment in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. My neighbor was an elderly retired woman (80+ seemed ancient to me at that age) who was the widowed wife of a retired steel worker. Her husband had worked all his life in the steel mills of central Pennsylvania with promises from big business and the union that, for his 30 years of service, he would have a pension and medical care to look forward to in his retirement. Instead he was one of the thousands who got nothing because the incompetent mill management and corrupt union (not to mention the government) raided their pension funds and stole their retirement. All she had was social security to live on.

In retrospect, the situation was laughable because here I was living on peanut butter and bread (or Ritz crackers when I could afford to splurge) for months at a time. When I got to know this poor figure and heard her story I felt worse for her plight than for my own (I, after all, I thought I had everything to in front of me). I was genuinely appalled at one point, as we exchanged stories and commiserated with each other over our situations, when she in her grandmotherly fashion tried to convince me that I would be “healthier” eating cat food (like her) rather than trying to get all my substance from peanut butter and bread. I couldn’t quite go there, but the impression was made. I decided that I didn’t trust big business to take care of me, and that I would take responsibility for my own future and myself.

Return to the early ‘80s, and here I was off to a terrifying start as a ‘wet-behind-the-ears’ contract software engineer... and two years later, thanks to the fine backroom, midnight effort by the sleazy executives of Arthur Andersen (the very same folks who later brought us Enron and other such calamities) and an equally sleazy New York Senator (Patrick Moynihan), we saw the passage of 1986 tax reform act with its section 1706.

For you who are unfamiliar, here is the core text of the IRS Section 1706, defining the treatment of workers (such as contract engineers) for tax purposes. Visit this link for a conference committee report (www.synergistech.com) regarding the intended interpretation of Section 1706 and the relevant parts of Section 530, as amended. For information on how these laws affect technical services workers and their clients, read our discussion here (www.synergistech.com).

SEC. 1706. TREATMENT OF CERTAIN TECHNICAL PERSONNEL.

(a) IN GENERAL - Section 530 of the Revenue Act of 1978 is amended by adding at the end thereof the following new subsection:

(d) EXCEPTION. - This section shall not apply in the case of an individual who pursuant to an arrangement between the taxpayer and another person, provides services for such other person as an engineer, designer, drafter, computer programmer, systems analyst, or other similarly skilled worker engaged in a similar line of work.

(b) EFFECTIVE DATE. - The amendment made by this section shall apply to remuneration paid and services rendered after December 31, 1986.

Note:

· "another person" is the client in the traditional job-shop relationship.

· "taxpayer" is the recruiter, broker, agency, or job shop.

· "individual", "employee", or "worker" is you.



Admittedly, you need to read the treatment to understand what it is saying but it’s not very complicated. The bottom line is that they may as well have put my name right in the text of section (d). Moreover, they could only have been more blunt if they would have came out and directly declared me a criminal and non-citizen slave. Twenty years later, I still can’t believe my eyes.

During 1987, I spent close to $5000 of my ‘pocket change’, and at least 1000 hours of my time writing, printing, and mailing to any senator, congressman, governor, or slug that might listen; none did, and they universally treated me as if I was wasting their time. I spent countless hours on the L.A. freeways driving to meetings and any and all of the disorganized professional groups who were attempting to mount a campaign against this atrocity. This, only to discover that our efforts were being easily derailed by a few moles from the brokers who were just beginning to enjoy the windfall from the new declaration of their “freedom”. Oh, and don’t forget, for all of the time I was spending on this, I was loosing income that I couldn’t bill clients.

After months of struggling it had clearly gotten to be a futile exercise. The best we could get for all of our trouble is a pronouncement from an IRS mouthpiece that they weren’t going to enforce that provision (read harass engineers and scientists). This immediately proved to be a lie, and the mere existence of the regulation began to have its impact on my bottom line; this, of course, was the intended effect.

Again, rewind my retirement plans back to 0 and shift them into idle. If I had any sense, I clearly should have left abandoned engineering and never looked back.

Instead I got busy working 100-hour workweeks. Then came the L.A. depression of the early 1990s. Our leaders decided that they didn’t need the all of those extra Air Force bases they had in Southern California, so they were closed; just like that. The result was economic devastation in the region that rivaled the widely publicized Texas S&L fiasco. However, because the government caused it, no one gave a shit about all of the young families who lost their homes or street after street of boarded up houses abandoned to the wealthy loan companies who received government funds to “shore up” their windfall. Again, I lost my retirement.

Years later, after weathering a divorce and the constant struggle trying to build some momentum with my business, I find myself once again beginning to finally pick up some speed. Then came the .COM bust and the 911 nightmare. Our leaders decided that all aircraft were grounded for what seemed like an eternity; and long after that, ‘special’ facilities like San Francisco were on security alert for months. This made access to my customers prohibitively expensive. Ironically, after what they had done the Government came to the aid of the airlines with billions of our tax dollars … as usual they left me to rot and die while they bailed out their rich, incompetent cronies WITH MY MONEY! After these events, there went my business but not quite yet all of my retirement and savings.

By this time, I’m thinking that it might be good for a change. Bye to California, I’ll try Austin for a while. So I moved, only to find out that this is a place with a highly inflated sense of self-importance and where damn little real engineering work is done. I’ve never experienced such a hard time finding work. The rates are 1/3 of what I was earning before the crash, because pay rates here are fixed by the three or four large companies in the area who are in collusion to drive down prices and wages… and this happens because the justice department is all on the take and doesn’t give a fuck about serving anyone or anything but themselves and their rich buddies.

To survive, I was forced to cannibalize my savings and retirement, the last of which was a small IRA. This came in a year with mammoth expenses and not a single dollar of income. I filed no return that year thinking that because I didn’t have any income there was no need. The sleazy government decided that they disagreed. But they didn’t notify me in time for me to launch a legal objection so when I attempted to get a protest filed with the court I was told I was no longer entitled to due process because the time to file ran out. Bend over for another $10,000 helping of justice.

So now we come to the present. After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again. But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle. After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.

When we received the forms back I was very optimistic that they were in order. I had taken all of the years information to Bill Ross, and he came back with results very similar to what I was expecting. Except that he had neglected to include the contents of Sheryl’s unreported income; $12,700 worth of it. To make matters worse, Ross knew all along this was missing and I didn’t have a clue until he pointed it out in the middle of the audit. By that time it had become brutally evident that he was representing himself and not me.

This left me stuck in the middle of this disaster trying to defend transactions that have no relationship to anything tax-related (at least the tax-related transactions were poorly documented). Things I never knew anything about and things my wife had no clue would ever matter to anyone. The end result is… well, just look around.

I remember reading about the stock market crash before the “great” depression and how there were wealthy bankers and businessmen jumping out of windows when they realized they screwed up and lost everything. Isn’t it ironic how far we’ve come in 60 years in this country that they now know how to fix that little economic problem; they just steal from the middle class (who doesn’t have any say in it, elections are a joke) to cover their asses and it’s “business-as-usual”. Now when the wealthy fuck up, the poor get to die for the mistakes… isn’t that a clever, tidy solution.

As government agencies go, the FAA is often justifiably referred to as a tombstone agency, though they are hardly alone. The recent presidential puppet GW Bush and his cronies in their eight years certainly reinforced for all of us that this criticism rings equally true for all of the government. Nothing changes unless there is a body count (unless it is in the interest of the wealthy sows at the government trough). In a government full of hypocrites from top to bottom, life is as cheap as their lies and their self-serving laws.

I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of shit at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along.

I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let’s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.



The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed.



Joe Stack (1956-2010)

02/18/2010
djskiggz 10:58 PM - 18 February, 2010
Did i mention he's a fucking idiot for killing himself and I think the news is saying his suicide killed 1 person too. not sure.
Dj-M.Bezzle 11:12 PM - 18 February, 2010
ya hes an idiot but i get where hes comming from, im in that same boat where it feels that everyones doing everything in their power to strip you of everything you have and you dont even have enough to take, it really does feel like a hopeless trap of a senario and your really limited on your choices to get out of it
djskiggz 11:42 PM - 18 February, 2010
Yup, we are sort of trapped and he might be right. There's so much corruption that there's almost no way out of it. To change the problem, we need to be VERY careful of who we elect into positions in government. But how is that possible when society is stuck in status quo of not knowing, understanding, or caring what is going on? It takes a disaster to get people to wake up and say, wait a minute....and if something bad happens, it might be too late. Then if for some reason we all wake up, even then, it might take years to filter out all of the trash in office....and then to fix the corrupted policies and laws....Ahhhhhhhhh, hell it's taken almost a century to screw everything up, it might take a century to fix it.

I thought this part was pretty interesting:

Quote:
And justice? You’ve got to be kidding!

"How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand. Yet, it mercilessly “holds accountable” its victims, claiming that they’re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand. The law “requires” a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if that’s not “duress” than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is."
DJ Prinvale` 1:08 AM - 19 February, 2010
It's all Linkin Parks fault

emo's
Free Man 4:43 PM - 19 February, 2010
i wonder what he felt the letter and taking his life would accomplish...
Dj-M.Bezzle 4:47 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
i wonder what he felt the letter and taking his life would accomplish...


you dont see what he was trying to accomplish? He was putting the spotlight on a fucked up system, a system that most people in this country are stuck in and think its just them and taking his life was the ONLY way he was going to get that message accross, he was correct, if he had just posted that letter or just championed his cause he never would have had 1 ear listening but since he did this it put national attn on it and got his message out there. That AND why the point he was at whats the point to keep living if your being prevented from living any kind of meaningful life
Banana_Peter 4:52 PM - 19 February, 2010
Where the hell did he get a plane????!!! I can't even get a passport
Dj-M.Bezzle 4:54 PM - 19 February, 2010
that is a good question....how does someone whos so broke he decides to kill hmself get a fuckin airplane? Acutually now that i think about it he was a engineer for plane places wasnt he? Mabye he just had access or knew how to get to a hangar and jacked one
Banana_Peter 4:56 PM - 19 February, 2010
I was going to point that out but wanted to know the plane question first. I've never met a broke ass person with an airplane lol
dj cubicle 4:59 PM - 19 February, 2010
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.
Dj-M.Bezzle 5:03 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.



that was explained in his letter though, if he just killed himself and left a letter noone would have heard this story, crash a plane into a building and its national news...he WAS right
Dj-M.Bezzle 5:05 PM - 19 February, 2010
heres the part i find disturbing
Quote:

Parker said she last saw Stack at one of his wife's recitals, and that the couple occasionally attended classical jazz house concerts the couple hosted in their home, a 2,500 square foot house on a street lined with oak trees in a middle-class Austin neighborhood that he bought in 2007. The home was set ablaze Thursday morning, burning to the ground as Sheryl and the couple's daughter watched from the street.


i dont see how buirning your wife and kids home down helps your cause any....hes just an ass for that
Banana_Peter 5:05 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.



that was explained in his letter though, if he just killed himself and left a letter noone would have heard this story, crash a plane into a building and its national news...he WAS right


I hate to agree, but yes he was right. I believe it was wrong for him to try injuring others, but it's not like he flew into Burger King.
Banana_Peter 5:08 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
heres the part i find disturbing
Quote:

Parker said she last saw Stack at one of his wife's recitals, and that the couple occasionally attended classical jazz house concerts the couple hosted in their home, a 2,500 square foot house on a street lined with oak trees in a middle-class Austin neighborhood that he bought in 2007. The home was set ablaze Thursday morning, burning to the ground as Sheryl and the couple's daughter watched from the street.


i dont see how buirning your wife and kids home down helps your cause any....hes just an ass for that


lol what a loser...
Dj-M.Bezzle 5:08 PM - 19 February, 2010
i may be giving him to much credit BUT he sounds like a smart guy, an engineer ect. Since noone was killed, mabye he was aware that the size, weight ect ect of the airplane wouldnt cause a collapse or anyting and wasnt crashing it to kill everyone in the building but mostly crashing to kill himself and draw attn to the target...one would think if his goal was to kill people he easily coulda crashed it into a section of the building where more people would be hurt
Dj-M.Bezzle 5:11 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
heres the part i find disturbing

Quote:

Parker said she last saw Stack at one of his wife's recitals, and that the couple occasionally attended classical jazz house concerts the couple hosted in their home, a 2,500 square foot house on a street lined with oak trees in a middle-class Austin neighborhood that he bought in 2007. The home was set ablaze Thursday morning, burning to the ground as Sheryl and the couple's daughter watched from the street.


i dont see how buirning your wife and kids home down helps your cause any....hes just an ass for that


lol what a loser...


i cant even really say that about him, i highly sympathize with his cause (though not necessarily his methods), unless your in a situation where your financial situation is keeping you from living any sembalance of a fulfilling life and theres no way out of it you really cant understand it
Banana_Peter 5:17 PM - 19 February, 2010
I meant he's a loser for burning down his own house. I guess the IRS was after his house as well?
Dj-M.Bezzle 5:20 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
I meant he's a loser for burning down his own house. I guess the IRS was after his house as well?



im sure SOMEBODY would have came and took it after his full frontal assult on the government lol....i would guess he had some major loans out from it so i guess it fits in with his situation to burn is so they cant get it back
Free Man 5:45 PM - 19 February, 2010
A statment would be if the IRS went on strike...
Banana_Peter 5:48 PM - 19 February, 2010
btw, you can be a loser no matter how smart you are or how much money you have. Just look at Gilbert Arenas and few others
Dj-M.Bezzle 6:23 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
A statment would be if the IRS went on strike...



why would the IRS go on strike their the winners in all of this
Dj-M.Bezzle 6:23 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
btw, you can be a loser no matter how smart you are or how much money you have. Just look at Gilbert Arenas and few others



very true, i dotn think anyone argued that. I just dont think you can qualify this guy as a loser
Banana_Peter 6:32 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
btw, you can be a loser no matter how smart you are or how much money you have. Just look at Gilbert Arenas and few others



very true, i dotn think anyone argued that. I just dont think you can qualify this guy as a loser


He got his point known, but I doubt anything will change. Life goes on and so will the IRS. I just don't agree with him ending the situation with violence.
Free Man 6:37 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
A statment would be if the IRS went on strike...



why would the IRS go on strike their the winners in all of this


are they? how are they winners? the IRS employees are just like any other federal govt employees.

I doubt they ever would,. but i know i wouldnt feel too good seeing annual incomes and taxes as high as they are...
Dj-M.Bezzle 6:41 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
btw, you can be a loser no matter how smart you are or how much money you have. Just look at Gilbert Arenas and few others



very true, i dotn think anyone argued that. I just dont think you can qualify this guy as a loser


He got his point known, but I doubt anything will change. Life goes on and so will the IRS. I just don't agree with him ending the situation with violence.


that was his entire point though, if it had ended in ANY other way except an extreme act of insane violence it never would have made it past a blurb in a local paper, he tried appealing and petitioning and writing letters and going to court and noone gave him the time of day it was buzz off and leave us alone unless you have money we can take. sure it may not have changed the world but at least he had the balls to stand up and do what he believed was necessary for what he believed in, it may not have made the world better but its a higher possibility of changing things then not doing anything
Dj-M.Bezzle 6:42 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
A statment would be if the IRS went on strike...



why would the IRS go on strike their the winners in all of this


are they? how are they winners? the IRS employees are just like any other federal govt employees.

I doubt they ever would,. but i know i wouldnt feel too good seeing annual incomes and taxes as high as they are...


because IRS employees going on strike wouldnt do anything about policy change, they make their living doing the fucked up shit this guy was protesting, higher taxes is more money in the pot for them
DJ Sniffles 7:05 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.


Oh so righteous!

War has casualties....
Dj-M.Bezzle 7:08 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:


Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.


lol exactly
Dj-M.Bezzle 7:09 PM - 19 February, 2010
oops misquote


Quote:
Quote:
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.


Oh so righteous!

War has casualties....


EXACTLY...there we go
dj cubicle 7:49 PM - 19 February, 2010
Quote:
Quote:
Kill yourself? Fine, I might listen.

Try to harm others in the process? I have no sympathy for whatever ideals you might have been standing for.


Oh so righteous!

War has casualties....


and...?
lurkith 10:23 PM - 19 February, 2010
He wouldn't have killed himself if government wasn't SO FUCKING BIG!!!! more taxes = more government
DJMark 12:21 AM - 20 February, 2010
Quote:
He wouldn't have killed himself if government wasn't SO FUCKING BIG!!!! more taxes = more government


Riiight.

"The Government Made Him Do It". Vote for Ron "Calvin Coolidge/Bob Taft" Paul in 2012 and we'll have less suicides. LOL. God I'm so glad I read this forum for priceless political enlightenment! :-)

Seriously, I don't begrudge anyone's right to check themselves off the planet at a time of their own choosing, but when they harm other people in the process that's something totally different.
drmemory 5:35 AM - 20 February, 2010
Why is nobody calling this guy a terrorist?
DJ Sniffles 5:40 AM - 20 February, 2010
Quote:
Why is nobody calling this guy a terrorist?



Because he's a Patriot
drmemory 5:45 AM - 20 February, 2010
Oh woooow... So killing fellow americans is ok if you wrap yourself in the flag eh?
DJ Sniffles 7:25 AM - 20 February, 2010
Quote:
Oh woooow... So killing fellow americans is ok if you wrap yourself in the flag eh?


You don't think there are prices to pay to prove what is really happening within our government?

How the fuck do you think we became to become a country to begin with?
DJ Sniffles 7:26 AM - 20 February, 2010
we *came to become a country
drmemory 7:47 AM - 20 February, 2010
That way leads to madness.... And for the record killing innocents on cnn is NOT how our country was founded.


Definition of terrorism.
A PREMEDITATED act of violence against innocent CIVILIANS intended to ATTRACT ATTENTION to a political grievance..


textbook
DJMark 11:55 AM - 20 February, 2010
Quote:
[You don't think there are prices to pay to prove what is really happening within our government?

How the fuck do you think we became to become a country to begin with?


So you're apparently advocating a replay of the American Revolution and/or the Civil War.

If either of those things happen, it's millions (possibly billions, hell...possibly *everyone*) dead in what would almost certainly end up being World War 3.

A nutjob flying an airplane into a building mostly populated by wage-slaves is an act of unmitigated stupidity. If it's a tribute to anything, it's to an apparently-growing sub-culture of willful ignorance.

And by the way, personal income taxes in the 1950's were far higher than they are today (the top rate was 90 percent at that time...with Dwight Eisenhower in the White House no less!). Somehow, Americans managed to deal without staging terrorist acts involving aircraft.
Dj-M.Bezzle 7:04 PM - 20 February, 2010
Quote:
That way leads to madness.... And for the record killing innocents on cnn is NOT how our country was founded.



how many innocents died in this?
DJ Sniffles 8:53 PM - 20 February, 2010
1
lurkith 9:43 PM - 24 February, 2010
Quote:
Somehow, Americans managed to deal without staging terrorist acts involving aircraft.


how many people had personal aircrafts then? come on. jk

you fuck so many people over and one of them is bound to crack eventually. (especial if he is already a little nuts.)
Dj-M.Bezzle 9:50 PM - 24 February, 2010
Quote:


And by the way, personal income taxes in the 1950's were far higher than they are today (the top rate was 90 percent at that time...with Dwight Eisenhower in the White House no less!). Somehow, Americans managed to deal without staging terrorist acts involving aircraft.


they had JUST come out of WW2 those fuckers were just happy to be alive
drmemory 10:24 AM - 26 February, 2010
By the way that "1" innocent who was murdered was a two term vietnam vet who served his country under fire.

Thats a patriot to me.
DJ Sniffles 11:11 AM - 26 February, 2010
Quote:
By the way that "1" innocent who was murdered was a two term vietnam vet who served his country under fire.

Thats a patriot to me.


Why?
DJ_Phenom 10:35 PM - 27 February, 2010
Damn just happened upon this thread, I live in Austin and work down the street from the building. Saw it on the local news 5 mins after it happened and could see the burning building from the parking lot. Pretty crazy shit, but if you push people too far they will break. I'm not a big believer in far left or far right conspiracies, but that Micheal Moore documentary Capitalism talks about alot of the stuff he mentions in detail. It was pretty good.
djskiggz 10:44 PM - 27 February, 2010
fuck michael moore!
DJ_Phenom 11:05 PM - 27 February, 2010
dude is a little off, but you can't say all his movies are bad, and that the shit he's saying doesn't have some truth behind it
lurkith 2:31 AM - 28 February, 2010
hes a good film maker, and even makes some good points, but the solutions he offers suck.
drmemory 11:11 AM - 2 March, 2010
If you have to ask why, you'll never fucking know.